Summary of Spell Casting with a Shield?

[Dross]

Except that a caster can swap her weapon to her shield hand as a free action, cast a spell, swap the weapon back, and still make attacks of opportunities with the weapon afterward.

So, there's no reason to lose the shield bonus, honestly.

Just to play devils advocate, but can you quote RAW that passing a weapon back and forth between hands is a FREE action? Or is it a house rule?

Mind you I don't have a reference that it is anything else except a memory that a rules of the game article said that it was/should be a move action. And lacking any definate rule I'm likely to say that placing a weapon in your other hand is a move action since it requires more thought and coordination than simply dropping the weapon, akin to sheathing it time wise.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

I'm just thinking it's a wee bit too advantageous to be able to swap your weapon from one hand to the other, cast a spell/manipulate a component with the other, swap the weapon back, and still gain the benefit of the shield for the rest of the round.

I'd be more inclined to allow the swap and spell casting, but to lose the AC benefit for the rest of the round. Or that swapping the weapon provokes an AoO.

Next thing ya know the cleric with the heavy shield will be tossing his weapon into the air, casting the spell, then catching the weapon as it comes down.

 

[Klaus]

Assuming you have a weapon in your other hand and the spell requires either a material or somatic component,

Can you cast a spell with a small shield? If yes, what happens to your AC?

You mean a light shield. Answer: Yes. You just switch your weapon to your shield hand (you can still hold things with your shield-hand while wielding a light shield). Nothing happens to your AC.

Can you cast a spell with a buckler? If yes, what happens to your AC?

Yes. Same as above.

If the spell requires a divine focus, does it need to be in-hand or can it be worn?

In-hand (even if it just means you must have a free hand to hold the symbol hanging from your neck). That's why you need at least one free hand.

The only shield that prevents you from casting a spell while holding a weapon in your main had is a heavy shield (you'd be forced to drop your weapon).

 

[Infiniti2000]

Just to play devils advocate, but can you quote RAW that passing a weapon back and forth between hands is a FREE action? Or is it a house rule?

There is no rule on it. Whether or not that defines it as a house rule is irrelevant. For example, I rule that it's a move action that does not provoke an AoO. So, you can move your weapon into your shield hand and then cast and that's it, maybe also taking a 5ft-step somewhere in there.

 

[irdeggman]

Except that a caster can swap her weapon to her shield hand as a free action, cast a spell, swap the weapon back, and still make attacks of opportunities with the weapon afterward.

So, there's no reason to lose the shield bonus, honestly.

So it is a free action to move a weapon to a shield hand.

Another free action to retrieve spell components

Another free action to retrieve (i.e., place a hand on/put in hand) the focus

The standard action for casting a spell includes using material components (but not retrieving them), manipulating a focus (but not getting it out) and performing somatic and verbal components involved in the actual casting.

Then it is another free action to put the focus back to where it was.

And yet another free action to retreive the weapon into hand so it can be "wielded".


That seems to an awful lot of "free" actions.

True the number allowed is up to the DM. But why should a spellcaster make out better than someone using a dagger who loses the AC of his buckler for the round if he uses the dagger in his "shield" hand?

 

[foxwick]

Well it might seem strange, but otherwise you have clerics/druids walking around with either no weapon, or no shield.

Hmm - just off the top of my head - can a character use two shields instead of shield/weapon? And what would that do to this discussion - could you hold one light shield with the other shielded hand/arm?

This discussion also reminded me of a fellow I played with who used to use several free actions to flip his dagger back and forth, left to right, before attacking, announcing each one. We all loved it - it was part of his persona. The DM eventually created some light "feint/bluff/dodge" rules for his behaviour - enemies even had to make a 50/50 check if they tried to disarm/sunder because you could never know which hand held the dagger.

 

[epicycloid]

Next thing ya know the cleric with the heavy shield will be tossing his weapon into the air, casting the spell, then catching the weapon as it comes down.

I smell a new feat for yet another splat book coming...

 

[irdeggman]

Well it might seem strange, but otherwise you have clerics/druids walking around with either no weapon, or no shield.

Why is that a bad thing?

This doesn't mean they don't have a weapon and/or shield, only that in order to cast spells they give up using one of the two for a round.

Seems a whole lot more balanced than allowing a wizard (anyone can equip a shield and use any weapon, abeit with minuses and restricitions) and be able to cast severe damaging spells and still make attacks with a weapon.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

That seems to an awful lot of "free" actions.

I concur. I don't have a problem with swapping the weapon to the shield hand and maybe even back again, but I definitely think there should be some kind of tradeoff. Either the loss of the shield's AC or an AoO or something else. Maybe Quick Draw allows you to pull it off, but otherwise there's a tradeoff...

 

[JiffyPopTart]

There are metamagic feats and class abilities that let you both CAST A SPELL and DELIVER CAST SPELL VIA A MELEE WEAPON in one round. This implies that by the WotC source game rules you should be able to simply cast a spell normally and not bother to swing your weapon in the same length of time.

And realistically, if a Monk can pull off 9 or 10 attacks in a round and still get an AoO why nitpick a cleric casting a spell and being able to AoO afterwards?

DS