Level Up (A5E) Summary: state of the rules and project?

[CapnZapp]

Hello.

I haven't kept up with the project, and I have a question:

At the time the project was started it was pitched as an "advanced 5th edition" (A5E) with more interesting* character building choices. Another idea that comes to mind when you hear about something pitched as an "advanced 5th edition" is more detailed rules** (here I have the three-action system of Pathfinder 2 in mind).
*) Read "complex" or "crunchy". Just more races or subclasses ain't it. *) I mean combat rules

I'm not particularly interested in tweaks of individual classes and races per se. I'm asking about generalities surrounding A5E's more complex charbuild on one hand, and its more detailed combat rules on the other. (If either of those ended up actually being included in the project of course). Call it an interest in the "core rules" rather than anything specific to any given race, class, background or somesuch. For instance, a general change "characters get a feat every two levels instead of every four" would be interesting. "The battlemaster fighter gets seven maneuvers instead of four" not so much.

Could you summarize the progress on this (or link to a summary) for those of us too lazy to trawl through playtests and forum debates; or at least a primer so we know where to look further?

If it's still too early and this info hasn't yet been decided on that'd be good to know as well. In fact, perhaps I could ask you if you think the project is 50% done? 10%? or what?

Much obliged, Zapp

 

[Morrus]

It's about 50% written and the first three chapters are in layout.

I guess the State of Level Up address from the end of December is the closest thing to what you're looking for.

A 'State of Level Up' Address! — Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition (A5E)

It's been three months since we announced Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition, and as 2020 closes, we felt it was a great time to give a status update!

www.levelup5e.com

 

[CapnZapp]

Thank you for that, but I still would like to know what, if any, actual specific rules changes were made to the combat engine. Also there's nothing on general changes to how classes are built. Does this mean the core of the game remains the same as 5E?

Let me just spitball three examples to show you what I'm guessing an "advanced" D&D game could do to "complexify" the experience of building a character. I'm thinking of things like more gradual feats (to be able to add more decision points; if you get a feat every other level instead of every fourth they need to be roughly half as powerful), more decision points (instead of a single choice of subclass, maybe one "block" of features given at the start of each tier of play). Finally replacing advantage with something less binary and more granular so buffing tactics is more than "you've got advantage so it's a done deal".

I'm not saying any one of these must necessarily be good ideas, just illustrations to explain what I'm asking about

 

[Morrus]

We haven’t released any combat rules playtests yet. I’ll let other people who’ve looked at the playtest packets answer the other questions (if they want!)

 

[dave2008]

Thank you for that, but I still would like to know what, if any, actual specific rules changes were made to the combat engine. Also there's nothing on general changes to how classes are built. Does this mean the core of the game remains the same as 5E?

Let me just spitball three examples to show you what I'm guessing an "advanced" D&D game could do to "complexify" the experience of building a character. I'm thinking of things like more gradual feats (to be able to add more decision points; if you get a feat every other level instead of every fourth they need to be roughly half as powerful), more decision points (instead of a single choice of subclass, maybe one "block" of features given at the start of each tier of play). Finally replacing advantage with something less binary and more granular so buffing tactics is more than "you've got advantage so it's a done deal".

I'm not saying any one of these must necessarily be good ideas, just illustrations to explain what I'm asking about

I don't know the current state of the classes, but the general idea was that their are more decision points when creating classes. I think that mostly comes through in class / subclass features, not feats.

The have previewed new exploration rules, skill system, and several classes, but not anything new with regard to combat or feats that I am aware of. The also previewed new monster entries and hinted at a new encounter builder.

 

[tetrasodium]

Thank you for that, but I still would like to know what, if any, actual specific rules changes were made to the combat engine. Also there's nothing on general changes to how classes are built. Does this mean the core of the game remains the same as 5E?

Let me just spitball three examples to show you what I'm guessing an "advanced" D&D game could do to "complexify" the experience of building a character. I'm thinking of things like more gradual feats (to be able to add more decision points; if you get a feat every other level instead of every fourth they need to be roughly half as powerful), more decision points (instead of a single choice of subclass, maybe one "block" of features given at the start of each tier of play). Finally replacing advantage with something less binary and more granular so buffing tactics is more than "you've got advantage so it's a done deal".

I'm not saying any one of these must necessarily be good ideas, just illustrations to explain what I'm asking about

I;m just someguy on the internet with a recent extended glut of socially distanced free time so no special knowledge so take things with a rain of salt. From a lot of the maneuvers & such it sounds like movement & possibly specific action based AoOs will play a much bigger role than o5e, well known terminology like provoke is back in use but I'm not sure about threaten & not going back to check. While I'd love to see a more granular replacement for 5e's ultramega-sized must have feats, I regretfully haven't seen anything that gives me even a flicker of hope for that yet.. on the up side it would probably be easy to retcon into the current early state of classes as design moves along. In a way the knacks (druid excepting) are rather feat-like while most classes have one or more class specific things like sorcerer manifestations/rogue tricks/fighter steely mien/etc that to a lesser degree allow them small feat-like choices to specialize or broaden their toolkit in various ways similar to how feats in 3.5 could.

I'm not sure what the final result for advantage will be as they tried minor (disadvantage/advantage(in spoiler or pg7 f fighter doc) but reports from the survey were not positive about it & thinking back I remember forum discussion breaking down into camps of what quickly paraphrased from memory amounted to one camp of "advantage is dimple & elegant this breaks the beauty" and a second camp of "advantage is a blunt club where a fine precise tool is needed, this is better... but I was hoping for something more"

Spoiler

There is a lot of new stuff hinted in the rogue doc involving traps & ways they can be used but some of it builds on choices made while leveling & references chapter12 (which we lack). Here's a little rogue proto-guide that touches on points at or at least connects some dots.

 

[CapnZapp]

Okay and thanks. It appears it's still early days and that they've saved the hard crunch for the remaining 50%. I'll check back in six months or so. Again thanks!

 

[Waller]

more gradual feats (to be able to add more decision points; if you get a feat every other level instead of every fourth they need to be roughly half as powerful)

Feats haven't been mentioend yet.

more decision points (instead of a single choice of subclass, maybe one "block" of features given at the start of each tier of play).

This is in. There's a choice of 3 things at each level.

Finally replacing advantage with something less binary and more granular so buffing tactics is more than "you've got advantage so it's a done deal".

They have expertise dice which appear to do a lot of the heavy lifting of advantage, with 3 levels of granularity (d4, d6, d8).

 

[Waller]

I'm thinking of things like more gradual feats (to be able to add more decision points; if you get a feat every other level instead of every fourth they need to be roughly half as powerful),

Thinking about it, I realize they have been mentioned. Just the half-feats aren't called feats. They're exploration knacks and maneuvers. All classes learn exploration knacks as they gain levels (faster than feats) and all the martial classes have a maneuver progress with ascending numbers f meneuvers and maximum maneuver degree (level). So yes, that's in there too. Just under a different name.

 

[CapnZapp]

Thinking about it, I realize they have been mentioned. Just the half-feats aren't called feats. They're exploration knacks and maneuvers. All classes learn exploration knacks as they gain levels (faster than feats) and all the martial classes have a maneuver progress with ascending numbers f meneuvers and maximum maneuver degree (level). So yes, that's in there too. Just under a different name.

Cool. Are these detailed in a central place or spread out over every class?

(Unless details are still forthcoming)