summoning problem- need help

[Gaiden]

Have been using this idea for some time now.

Simple solution - buy/make/acquire a picutre of the church and surrounding area as well as a map. Just have it out before you cast the spell - round one show pictures - round two say touch chest - round 3 say teleport to that location and deliver contents.

Already have preset location with church that you teleport to and just leave contents.

If you can't teleport inside teleport nearby (you had picture of surroundings). Then go inside to designated spot.

And if it is unscheduled - just do a sending first.

 

[Pielorinho]

I've ruled that the Gods in my campaign find such a use of their servants to be trivial and demeaning. Used occasionally, it's okay; used regularly, a cleric risks losing access to lantern archons entirely.

This satisfies my players, who get to use a cool tactic on the rare occasion, without changing the dynamic of my world.

Daniel

 

[Kyramus]

I believe there is a negotiation of what the cleric wants done and what the cleric will give to the archon or deity.

I'd suggest that he can use the lantern archon, but must fulfill the task set before him before he can summon another. If he uses the lantern archon repeatedly as a messenger, make an arbitrary 50% chance that something more powerful than a lantern archon shows up and tells the cleric is a polite manner to cease bugging celestial agents with trivial matters as sending a message to a church. They have the spell sending for that as well as walking to the church.
Then use his level as a guideline of how long he can't cast lesser planar binding.

 

[smetzger]

I believe there is a negotiation of what the cleric wants done and what the cleric will give to the archon or deity.

I'd suggest that he can use the lantern archon, but must fulfill the task set before him before he can summon another. If he uses the lantern archon repeatedly as a messenger, make an arbitrary 50% chance that something more powerful than a lantern archon shows up and tells the cleric is a polite manner to cease bugging celestial agents with trivial matters as sending a message to a church. They have the spell sending for that as well as walking to the church.
Then use his level as a guideline of how long he can't cast lesser planar binding.

That ruling is completly contrary to the description of the Summoning Spell.

 

[Gaiden]

I believe there is a negotiation of what the cleric wants done and what the cleric will give to the archon or deity.

That is a house rule if instituted for a summon spell. That is the case for a summon planar ally spell, though.

Those who suggest clerics should not make regular use of this tactic are IMO arbitrating DM powers based on their interpretation on what "should" and "should not" happen in their games. Why shouldn't a cleric use this tactic often? It seems to me, that if a cleric is sending a message to a church it has to do with their faith. It is not the same as using the archon to send a message to the local tailor to have a special outfit made for a party or something of the like. Why would a lantern archon have a problem being a messenger every day and not have a problem fighting for the cleric? According to the same logic, the lantern archon might get annoyed at constantly being bothered to help the cleric defeat some mundane monstrous threat or the like.

If I were a player in such games I would be hardpressed to buy the argument that the archons don't have time for me - especially when I am using them in a fashion that is much more directly correlated to my faith than fighting some creature that may have absolutely nothing to do with my faith.

Here is just another example of trolling on player's innovations and creativity.

 

[Lucius Foxhound]

Here's a question: since the Archon can teleport w/o error with 50 lbs of "objects," could a Wizard polymorph himself into a something small and light and then teleport w/o error? I realize it says "object," but polymorph any object includes people and animals as well.

Just seeing if there's a way for an 11th level Wizard to cast Teleport w/o error....

 

[Pielorinho]

Those who suggest clerics should not make regular use of this tactic are IMO arbitrating DM powers based on their interpretation on what "should" and "should not" happen in their games.

At the risk of being insulting, Duh. That's why I'm the DM. Arbitrating what "should" and "should not" happen in my game is an important part of my job.

I recognize that it'sa house rule -- but it's hardly an unreasonable one, given that it prevents turning angels into glorified fax machines. Because I don't want a world with easy instantaneous communication, because I like the idea of building missions around acting as couriers, I have to house-rule away this ability in some form or another.

The way I described it is palatable to my players. It allows them to use their creative tactic on occasion. But if they start to rely on it, their God tells them that he doesn't grant angels to act as speedy bicycle messengers.

YMMV, obviously. If this doesn't work for your game, don't house-rule it. But alsiho is clearly looking for a solution to what he perceives as a problem; it is mystifying that you'd condemn any solution to the problem.

Daniel

 

[smetzger]

At the risk of being insulting, Duh. That's why I'm the DM. Arbitrating what "should" and "should not" happen in my game is an important part of my job.

I recognize that it'sa house rule --

Then you shouldn't say "I believe..." and then go and present your House Rule in a manner that suggests it is a rule, especially when you are in the D&D Rules forum.

This forum is not for discussing House Rules.

 

[coyote6]

Here's a question: since the Archon can teleport w/o error with 50 lbs of "objects," could a Wizard polymorph himself into a something small and light and then teleport w/o error? I realize it says "object," but polymorph any object includes people and animals as well.

Polymorph any object is an 8th level Transmutation spell; any wizard that can cast it ought to be capable of teleporting without error all by his lonesome -- that spell is only 7th level.

However, bags of holding are objects, and a type I bag will hold 250 lbs -- more than enough for the average wizard (the stout clerics in plate might have more trouble). The wizard in the bag will have 10 minutes of air (more than enough), and the bag weighs 15 lbs -- well under the archon's weight limit.

Of course, you have to have a spare bag of holding that you don't mind giving up at least for a while, and the transportee better not have his own bag or portable hole . . .

If people did count as "objects", you could do this stunt at 7th level. Cast reduce (knocking yourself & your gear to ~10% of your normal weight -- not a lot of 400+ lb PC wizards, I imagine), then summon monster IV. You might need tongues, too. Ta-da.

 

[Pielorinho]

Then you shouldn't say "I believe..." and then go and present your House Rule in a manner that suggests it is a rule, especially when you are in the D&D Rules forum.

Fortunately I didn't say that: I said, "I've ruled that the Gods in my campaign find such a use of their servants to be trivial and demeaning." The official rule had already been discussed and clarified; as is common in this forum, people were offering potential house rules once the official rule had been settled.

Daniel