"The fighter" class doesn't have magic. Subclasses, other classes, and feats do.
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- Thread starter Veltharis ap Rylix
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Vaalingrade
Legend
Unless you can fly. OR are in a well designed encounter and can also climb or jump good.
Or jumpers. Or climbers. Or Barbarians. Or Wizards. Or someone walking around them.
Even places that are hard to reach for fliers? Like the heart of a dense forest or thorn thicket? the depths of a cave? A tight squeeze between storage crates? That spot at the small of your back where you can never quite scratch? Literally anything that's not 'way up high' or 'in a hole open to the air'?
So many other games don't have any issue with cheap and plentiful flight, but only D&D teaches DMs to fear one of five characters not having to waste time climbing a cliff, avoiding those bears inexplicably wandering the savannah instead of being in the woods, or sassing an ogre that's too dumb to master rock technology.
doctorbadwolf
Heretic of The Seventh Circle
The whole “fighters aren’t magic” thing is entirely irrelevant to your false claim that only 1 edition gave the fighter choices round by round.
The "Fighter has magic" and the "Fighter is magic" mean different things in D&D.
In that edition with round by round choice, the fighter was magic. It didn't have it.
That being said, the fighter doesn't need magic to design a way for it to have fast round by round choice.
James Gasik
We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Or, more accurately, they shouldn't need magic, but WotC seems to think otherwise.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Focusing on the fighter is muddying the waters. Players should have the option to play characters who have many round-by-round tactical decisions and long-term strategic decisions to make, without needing that character to have magic. Which is why weapon masteries are a good idea, and could probably even stand to be a bit more complex.
Likewise, players should have the option to play characters who have very few round-by-round tactical decisions and long-term strategic decisions to make, without needing that character to eschew magic. Which is why putting the warlock on the same spell management system as every other spellcaster is a bad idea.
doctorbadwolf
Heretic of The Seventh Circle
In D&D, there is a difference between being magical and having magic (spells, rituals, prayers, channels, invocations, incantations, etc)
The 4e fighter becomes magical without itself having magic. However none of that matters in creating fast weapons combat that could be both simple and complex.
It was about designing around a baseline and commiting to catering to both styles.
doctorbadwolf
Heretic of The Seventh Circle
The 4e fighter isn’t magical.
Kobold Avenger
Legend
A Fireball hitting 4 targets should take less time because you roll once for damage 8d6, you usually don't have to add any bonuses to that damage, and I group numbers from die into sums of 5's or 10's to count damage to make the total easier to count. Then it's 4 targets roll their saving throw, usually the DMs job to do. It's either the total or half that for each target.
4 Melee attacks does take more time, because many players prefer to roll attacks first and then damage second. And the results of each roll can determine who they target on the next roll in a round. Some players do roll attack and damage at the same time, and having each separate attack using different colours, but with it's individual d20 and damage die having matching colours, helps distinguish for which attack each one is for. But it could be quite disappointing seeing a high damage roll connected to a missed attack with this method.
4 Melee attacks does take more time, because many players prefer to roll attacks first and then damage second. And the results of each roll can determine who they target on the next roll in a round. Some players do roll attack and damage at the same time, and having each separate attack using different colours, but with it's individual d20 and damage die having matching colours, helps distinguish for which attack each one is for. But it could be quite disappointing seeing a high damage roll connected to a missed attack with this method.
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