Technology in Fantasy

[Gellion]

With the increasing popularity of Steampunk. I thought this would be an interesting issue to adress. In some fantasy worlds i have seen, there is always the lone inventor who lives by His/Herself, and makes technilogical items waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond the technilogical level of the world. Most of these items are of a Sci-Fi level of technology, and would normally seem out of place, but somehow they do not. The reason this technology does not spread is because it is either in a nation where they are loathe to give away their secrets. Or is made by a lone inventor, who everybody is afraid of. So do you like the idea of very high levels of technology in a fantasy world, if they are used with some of the above ideas? I know a lot of people here have to have an explaination for everything, so is it a feasible idea?

And if anybody here is wondering, i just sort of have a habit of making up different fantasy worlds in my head. Which is the reaon i post a lot of topics having to do with fantasy settings. I also like the idea of more advanced thecnology in a fantasy setting, which is why you will also see a lot of posts like this by me.

 

[s/LaSH]

I wouldn't have a problem with it, I don't think. There's a lot more technology in history than many people realise, which makes for some interesting little true stories. Like energy weapons versus triremes (well, giant parabolic mirrors designed by a Greek philosopher to defend against the Romans, but it still packed the punch of a major-league laser), or some of the things the Chinese did. So the historical-accuracy bug in me is satisfied, and the coolness bug is satisfied too.

 

[Crothian]

I actually perfer the lower levels of technology beind discovered and allowing the PC to see what they do. IMC the printing press is soon going to be invented. Of course, books have been magically copied for a while now, but the printing press will make books availible to ever man.

 

[fusangite]

Gellion says,

So do you like the idea of very high levels of technology in a fantasy world, if they are used with some of the above ideas? I know a lot of people here have to have an explaination for everything, so is it a feasible idea?

OK-- here is my problem. Obviously, physics in fantasy world are different than physics in the real world. Otherwise, magic would not work. So, the idea of technology based on modern Newtonian/Einsteinian physics seems a little dumb to me. The physical laws which exist in fantasy worlds are going to produce different kinds of technology based on the rules for those magic systems. What might interest me is looking at what kind of tech different physical laws would produce.

Another interesting question for me is: how would an industrialized D&D world look? In a sense, magic has allowed the residents of Faerun, Greyhawk, etc. to enjoy some of the benefits of industrialized society without having to industrialize. Just imagine what a dangerous powerhouse you would have if some society in a fantasy world were able to industrialize and use all those Conjuration and Evocation spells out there to power an industrial society.

 

[Gellion]

I admit i really do not worry about such things as the physics of a fantasy world. And lets assume that the physics of the world allowed for normal magic, as well as the making of technilogical items.

 

[Gellion]

Also i really do not base my worlds off of any society that ever existed. Well, maybe a little bit, but not much. The only thing my worlds have in common with ours are things like weapons like swords and such.

 

[Tonguez]

model Steam engines where known in ancient Greece
Egypt might have had Static Electricity generators
and the Parthian 'Battery' (clay pots packed with tar enclosing zinc and magneseum rods) produce a mild electrical current

On the basis of the above it is quite plausible IMHO to have battery powered 'Lightning Spears' and Steam powered golems. Greek Fire backpack 'flame throwers' are plausible and of course gunpowder rockets were used in China for centuries.
Man-lifting Kites were known and used (the danger being the ability to land safely not the ability to 'fly')

Magic and technology are pretty much interchangi=able in a Fantasy world and really once Constructs become common and 'standard' you pretty much have a technofantasy world by default.

 

[Tonguez]

Gellion says,
OK-- here is my problem. Obviously, physics in fantasy world are different than physics in the real world. Otherwise, magic would not work. So, the idea of technology based on modern Newtonian/Einsteinian physics seems a little dumb to me..

Yeah I tend to have that inkling too (which is why I hate hearing about Germ theory of disease and adavanced medical techniques in fantasy settings. come on people everyone knows 'Germs' don't cause disease people- Goblin poisons and Evil Spirits cause disease!)

However having to go out and create a whole set of physical laws is just more effort than I'm willing to invest in my homebrews so I have

Three possible solutions
1. Magic does work according to Laws of Physics, its just that current science isn't quite advanced enough to understand exactly how it works (its all quantum and chaos afterall)

2. Newtonian/Eisteinian physics doesn't apply. But the Laws of the Fantasy World do have similar effects in a given range of circumstances

3. The Law of Narrative Impetus is much stronger than the Laws of Physics (ie if it makes a good story it works)

 

[Gellion]

3. The Law of Narrative Impetus is much stronger than the Laws of Physics (ie if it makes a good story it works)

That is what i normally use.

 

[fusangite]

Tonguez says

Yeah I tend to have that inkling too (which is why I hate hearing about Germ theory of disease and adavanced medical techniques in fantasy settings. come on people everyone knows 'Germs' don't cause disease people- Goblin poisons and Evil Spirits cause disease!)

Agreed. I'm guessing you have seen Steve Martin's medieval barber skit...

Somewhat off-topic interlude:

My current favourite story about medieval disease is that the one empirically tested theory of treating battlefield wounds was the one which said that one must destroy the sword which inflicted the wound. Modern doctors have confirmed that this method of treatment would, indeed, have produced the best survival rate of all available treatment options. This is because it, unlike all others, did not involve anyone actually touching the wound.

However having to go out and create a whole set of physical laws is just more effort than I'm willing to invest in my homebrews so I have

Same here. Although I am having fun doing that in one world where that's the main creative project. Generally, my tendency is to do the Ars Magica thing and find a kind of pre-modern natural philosophy and use that.

Until Gary Gygax burst my bubble, I had always assumed the D&D world ran on Aristotelian physics -- thus, heavy things fall faster than light things, etc. Given that D&D uses a 4-element system no dissimilar to Aristotle's five elements, it's pretty easy to just import Aristotelian physics whole hog for European settings and medieval Taoist physics for oriental settings.

Anyway, because of the simplicity of Aristotle's system, it's pretty easy to handle aerodynamics, thermodynamics, etc. with minimal research.