D&D 4E The 4E warlock -- love at first glimpse

[Nyeshet]

It reminds me of "With a Single Spell," when a young magician finds a jar-opening spell. The spell summons a humongous demon who appears, opens a stuck jar, then gets sucked back into Hell, howling.

Technically, it's not the same as plane shift twice... it's more like summon monster, with a one round duration, that is cast on the same plane and sends them somewhere else.

It seems pretty farcical to me. I 'm not feeling the love.

So, this 'send foe to hell for a round' curse is basically a 'summon monster' spell in reverse? Yeah, I guess that sounds about right. So the curse tags a foe to be summoned by the warlock's patron, where upon the foe is tortured / slain, but due to the fact it was a summoning it doesn't actually kill the foe - just thoroughly shock / horrify him, causing some pychosomatic damage (to hp) in the process?

Eh, put me down as being disappointed in this. I never really liked the summon magic in the first place, as it seems to only summon an shadow-like illusion of a being on another plane, albeit forcing their awareness into the illusion for the duration of the spell or until the destruction of said shadowy illusion.

As for the three patron types, I'm also guessing devils, fey, and something from the shadowfell plane (spirits? phantoms? ghosts? wraiths? incorporeal undead in general? or can a powerful vampire or lich also invest power into a warlock?).

If the 4e warlock actually has different mechanical traits due to differing patron type then I might enjoy it a bit more. I never really understood how a 3.5e warlock - who flavor text suggested could potentially have gotten his powers from a fey - would have DR vs silver instead of cold iron, as an example.

 

[ForceUser]

You'll get used to it, trust me.

Every time I come to EN World after a long break, I'm quickly reminded of why I don't come here much anymore. Even with heavy moderation, this place is a cesspool of passive-aggressive vitriol and constant broadsides of intense negativity. For every person just trying to say "I think [something] is a cool idea," there's a person who has to explain not just why it's not a cool idea (which is fine), but why you're a moron for thinking that it is a cool idea. I don't want to engage in the negativity anymore, but it's hard to let it pass.

And I'm sorry if I just derailed my own thread.

 

[Rechan]

Every time I come to EN World after a long break, I'm quickly reminded of why I don't come here much anymore. Even with heavy moderation, this place is a cesspool of passive-aggressive vitriol and constant broadsides of intense negativity. For every person just trying to say "I think [something] is a cool idea," there's a person who has to explain not just why it's not a cool idea (which is fine), but why you're a moron for thinking that it is a cool idea. I don't want to engage in the negativity anymore, but it's hard to let it pass.

For me, as I circulate political forums all the time, this place feels about the same.

Take that for what you will.

 

[gothmaugCC]

it'll be interesting to see if there are role-play problems with having a warlock and a paladin in the party at the same time.

Nah, There probably going to axe alignments in 4th edition, and If they dont, I'm pretty sure paladin will no longer be "lawful good only".

 

[Jack7]

I think if you can't blink in and out of hell every now and again then it isn't really magic.

 

[ForceUser]

For me, as I circulate political forums all the time, this place feels about the same.

Take that for what you will.

Yeah, see, that's what I'm saying!

 

[UndeadScottsman]

The way I see it is that this isn't a full planeshift spell. The target is still rooted to the material plane; but the warlock briefly "pushes" the target into hell; but the Warlock can't hold him there for long and he snaps back to the material plane.

Or it might just be a low level illusion spell; or it might send them to a pocket dimension of fire (like a bag of holding, only with brimstone), or it might be a once a day ability that lets you ask your patron devil to pull the target straight down to hell for a round.

 

[Rechan]

Just thought I'd post this before the "Warlock is all evil all the time" spills over here.

From Rich Baker's blog

Tomorrow I'll be working on the warlock class description. The development's done, so I'm really going to be looking to fine-tune the presentation and the flavor. We're going to have a "warlock flavor meeting" to talk about "developing" the class flavor. Just how close can we skate on the dark-and-sinister angle? What sort of naming themes do we want to use for powers? Would it be cool to give the warlock a strong planar theme and use names like Mire of Minauros and Armor of Agathys? (I sorta like 'em, they've got a nice Doctor Strange ring to them). Or would it be better to stay off of obscure previous-edition references like that? I'm looking forward to the conversation.

...

We're going to try to make those a little more explicit toward effect than they were in 3E -- in other words, I want to make sure that the text explains exactly what the power's doing. Something like You fire an ebon ray of necromantic energy that lances straight to your oponent's heart is probably more useful than text like You stand on one foot, close one eye, and think of pigeons; from your outstetched little finger a burst of soul-shattering black energy lances into your foe's heart and explodes it. We'll see how if I got the right balance.

I did similar work on the warlock powers over the last couple of days. It was actually a little tough with the warlock powers, because the warlock's got many more powers than he had before, and we don't want all of them to just drip with evil. Making sure that several different varieties of warlock flavor were scattered through the powers was important to me. Fortunately a good number of cleric powers are "classics" that have been around for a long time, so a little bit o' polish and they're good for another edition.

 

[M.L. Martin]

Just thought I'd post this before the "Warlock is all evil all the time" spills over here.

Thanks; that's reassuring. The warlock as described in the D&D column makes for a great villain or anti-hero, but if it's going to be a core class, I'd like some more room to play and to use it in a straightforward heroic campaign.

Hopefully the core books will include enough non-sinister flavor for the warlock to tide us over until the arcane book includes the celestial-powered variant. (They did it as a prestige class in Complete Mage, IIRC, so I expect/hope they'll include a talent tree and/or power set to that effect in a supplement devoted to wizards and warlocks.)

 

[Klaus]

Judging by the text, a warlock chooses a patron from the Shadowfell, Nine Hells or Feywild ("shadowy, infernal or feral").

Hopefully I can still make up a Sidhe Archer-version of the warlock.