"The aim is for the players to have fun"

[Omegaxicor]

told you I missed something important...

I don't know what is "common" but mostly killing enemies because they don't enjoy politics (and neither do I really), we do have to recover items to either help them defeat other enemies (A holy relic which must be sent down the river, by local tradition, to prevent an uprising of plagues and undead forces) or allow them access to a treasure trove, guarded of course.

Combat is common because they aren't good at mysteries, or maybe I am not good at making mysteries but I have used preset ones and they don't work either, so there's only really combat for the most part

EDIT: I have looked back over our current campaign's completed quests and it seems combat is much more prevalent, there is NO adventure without combat but some have only one fight (few quests end without a final encounter being a fight) BUT not all characters have died in the final fight of the quest...

 

[Neonchameleon]

told you I missed something important...I don't know what is "common" but mostly killing enemies because they don't enjoy politics (and neither do I really), we do have to recover items to either help them defeat other enemies (A holy relic which must be sent down the river, by local tradition, to prevent an uprising of plagues and undead forces) or allow them access to a treasure trove, guarded of course.Combat is common because they aren't good at mysteries, or maybe I am not good at making mysteries but I have used preset ones and they don't work either, so there's only really combat for the most part

Mostly combat - which means that people want to change up their combat stats because that's most of what matters in the game. And the PCs swap out characters and build for combat. I'd try changing systems - I'd do it twice I think. First I'd run a one shot of Dread (assuming Jenga drives no one to a violent rage) - mostly as a pallete clenser. Then I'd try for half a dozen sessions of Leverage to open everything up (the pitch: "In 2002 a crack commando unit was sent to prison for a crime they didn't commit..." - and yes, I'm going to use this as a pitch myself). Both games are very tightly themed, evocative, and easy to run with few rules for the players to worry about - but I wouldn't run out of genre with either. And those two games between them should blow their expectations wide open.

 

[Quickleaf]

Piggybacking off [MENTION=87792]Neonchameleon[/MENTION]'s question: So there are lots of fights, which your players are content with but you are not. Yet you don't care for politics or mystery...what *do* you wish there was more of in your campaign?

As a first step to branching out from all-combat all-the-time, could you include alternate combat goals besides "kill all enemies"?

 

[Omegaxicor]

I don't have a problem with pure combat, just the high mortality rate, and even that isn't a problem if the players cared about their characters more

I don't mind puzzle encounters but the players aren't very good at them, admittedly my design skills are poor so we have used preset ones which may be an issue. We have had adventures about holding a line against enemies for as long as they can, the longer the better and the more Exp. I have tried an encounter involving the preparing of castle defences against an enemy army, then rallying the troops which worked well but wasn't enjoyed.

I don't know anything about either of those systems, I will look into them

EDIT: I like the look of Dread, I just don't think I want to spend money on something the players might like, is there a sample quest somewhere?

I don't like the look of Leverage for the same reason I don't like the show, there is no risk/reward, you ARE watching a TV show, win/lose/draw the players will be back next week no better or worse off...DnD has a changing plots, the characters win big and lose big or win and lose in equal measure

of course, that might be the problem so a sample quest might be ok

 

[am181d]

I don't have a problem with pure combat, just the high mortality rate, and even that isn't a problem if the players cared about their characters more

Sorry if someone has pointed this out upthread, but it's sounds to me like the problem is you're not very good at choosing appropriate leveled threats for your PCs. As a result, the mortality rate is significantly higher than it should be.

In a well-structured game, there should always be the RISK of character mortality, but actual character deaths should be relatively rare. If deaths are happening frequently, it's presumably because you're overwhelming your players and/or not providing them with sufficient resources to combat the enemies you're sending at them.

Try dialing down the combats *slightly* (design an encounter and then remove a minion or two or lower everybody's HP by 10%) and see if that addresses the problem.

 

[Teacher Man]

Have you tried a premade series like the Giants modules? It will give them a set goal, it has a mix of combat investigation and you don't have to reinvent the wheel. There are conversions for them here on the site.

 

[Omegaxicor]

I will look into Giants, and I will try weakening the enemies but I think that will immediately have the opposite effect, like I said the difference between easy victory and TPK is a roll of the dice without changing the enemies at all

EDIT: I can't find anything on Giants [MENTION=6702166]Teacher Man[/MENTION] do you have any links to the material?

 

[Teacher Man]

They are in the conversions part of the forum from 1st edition to 3.5. I think there were also links to the pdf files of the original adventures there as well. I created 15th level characters for the adventure since I am running a tournament. So far so good although the wizard did almost entomb himself in a wall of ice...