The Devil's in the Details: Slavicsek reveals the Pit Fiend in all its glory

[Kraydak]

Are you assuming the weapon adds to his damage? Because everything we've seen says it doesn't. The Magic Item article hinted that the "big three" are sort of meant to balance each other. You have a weapon (or implement) for attacks, armor for AC, and the neck slot for F/R/W. It all works out, as long as weapons don't increase damage. We know a magic weapon adds to crit damage. If it also adds to normal damage, that would be redundant.

The recent magic item article strongly suggests that it is +to hit/+to damage. However, most of the boost comes from the +hit.

As for DR (I assume FR is a typo), you'll note that as a level 26 demon he doesn't have any. Which is a very, very good clue that there isn't any in 4e at all. I'm pretty sure one of the designers said as much, anyways.

Against a foe with mere FR 5 (you are going up against a freaking fire devil, be prepared), his mace does a pathetic d12+6, with no ongoing effect. Now, if you were a highly intelligent, wise and presumably wealthy devil lord with a massive overload of fire based damage abilities, what weapon would you choose? Something that is *useless* against people ready for you, or something that ignores defenses against fire *and* does more damage even against people without fire protection to boot?

If you are wearing armor (is he? if not, why not?), wouldn't you invest in the very best? Same with the neck slot. But, given his equipment list, he appears to be virtually flat broke. He should sell his mace and buy something actually useful. But wait, that wouldn't be *thematic*, and it would imperil *the math*! If he actually is using the gear, why can't I steal it or dispel it during the fight, or loot it after? If is isn't, WHY OH WHY isn't he?!

(again, in 3e, without the math being a central selling point, this wasn't as important. And even then, lots of monsters were statted up with appropriate power-level armor and weapons)

 

[Khaim]

Yes, I can "just make it up". Which leads me to ask why I'm buying a Monster Manual...or a rules set...when the kneejerk response to every complaint about missing or oversimplified information is "Dude, just make it up!"

Well, I'm going to buy it for the mechanics and the ability to run a game quickly without spending a lot of time on such things. It's a lot easier to make up things about what a Pit Fiend does when he's off camera that it is to "wing it" when the PCs suddenly decide to attack him.

 

[kodyboy]

If I wanted to play a video game I would.......why are they trying to make D&D into one?

 

[helium3]

So, basically, he's as good at everything as any other monster of his level is. He has no special powers to help him fulfill his role *in hell*, just his role as an opponent for the PCs. He has a bland, boring, list of a great big THREE skills. He has no mechanical existence outside his combat role. He appears to fight the PCs, then he's done. Everything about him is centered on his existence in the encounter. (I mean, he doesn't even have Planes knowledge!) ("So, Pit-dude...where do you live?" "I dunno. Don't have that skill. Let's rumble!")

I wouldn't get so bent out of shape about the skills. My hunch is that they're doing something pretty different with skills and they don't want to reveal too much yet. Those probably aren't even the skills he'll have when the MM is printed.

 

[Khaim]

The recent magic item article strongly suggests that it is +to hit/+to damage. However, most of the boost comes from the +hit.

You might be right; I'll have to reread it. Memory says you're wrong, but mine is terrible.

Against a foe with mere FR 5 (you are going up against a freaking fire devil, be prepared), his mace does a pathetic d12+6, with no ongoing effect. Now, if you were a highly intelligent, wise and presumably wealthy devil lord with a massive overload of fire based damage abilities, what weapon would you choose? Something that is *useless* against people ready for you, or something that ignores defenses against fire *and* does more damage even against people without fire protection to boot?

If you are wearing armor (is he? if not, why not?), wouldn't you invest in the very best? Same with the neck slot. But, given his equipment list, he appears to be virtually flat broke. He should sell his mace and buy something actually useful. But wait, that wouldn't be *thematic*, and it would imperil *the math*! If he actually is using the gear, why can't I steal it or dispel it during the fight, or loot it after? If is isn't, WHY OH WHY isn't he?!

(again, in 3e, without the math being a central selling point, this wasn't as important. And even then, lots of monsters were statted up with appropriate power-level armor and weapons)

Well, your attitude towards the math aside, you make a good point. He is rather one-dimensional, and his total lack of magic gear is sort of odd. I know they're reducing reliance on magic items, but he's a 26th level demon lord, he should have something.

 

[Lizard]

Legion devil legionnaires? Talk about an awkward name....

Pitchfork Kid, Seduction Lass, Flame Boy, Torture Teen...

 

[Voss]

SAGA had damage that increased by level, mostly since everything was ranged and you needed a decent way to increase damage at all. D&D doesn't need that, and I haven't seen anything to suggest that your level bonus applies to damage. It does apply to just about all d20 rolls, though.

Actually, bonus damage based on level is in for PCs. Its mentioned in the paladin smites article.

In binding smite you can see an example of how the effect of a smite goes up with level, while the numbers in their base form seem similar when not taking into account the accuracy and damage boosts that merely gaining levels (and having better weapons) affords

So just from the two smites that we know he has access to, and his normal attacks, I think (if it works like saga and is a half damage bonus), a paladins damage output could look like this (assuming reasonable starting stats, 14-16 in strength, wisdom and charisma)
round 1: at least 40 (smite) [2d8 +13x2+3x2]+3
round 2: at least 40 (smite#2)
and then around 20 or so from then on. [d8+13+3]

Probably more depending on how weapon damage works, exactly. whether there is power attack, magic item bonuses are hit and damage, assorted miscellaneous bonuses, etc.

 

[Lackhand]

If I wanted to play a video game I would.......why are they trying to make D&D into one?

More to the point, if they were trying, don't you think they'd be succeeding at it?

I'm glad you're here to play D&D, like we all are. I can't wait to see the heroes that are ready to take this thing on!

 

[helium3]

You might be right; I'll have to reread it. Memory says you're wrong, but mine is terrible.

Well, your attitude towards the math aside, you make a good point. He is rather one-dimensional, and his total lack of magic gear is sort of odd. I know they're reducing reliance on magic items, but he's a 26th level demon lord, he should have something.

Having gear of any sort becomes a problem if its expected that the players are going to be killing 50+ monsters (10 of which are pit fiends) in a single day of adventuring.

As it stands, the party will get 10 of those flame-touched maces plus whatever's on the other 3 X 10 devils, plus all the summoned monsters.

Oh wait, maybe that's why they explode . . .

 

[JoelF]

I'm surprized no one mentioned that the Point of Terror is a fear affect which gives a -5 to all defenses. I'm having trouble seeing how being scared, even REALLY scared, would affect your fort defense. I get that if you're scared you don't defend against physical attacks and don't dodge as quick, and your mental strength (Will) would be weaker, but how does being scared make your more vulnerable to poison?