Morbog of Ghetto D said:
Greetings and salivations,
So heres the topic that has been killing me for 3weeks. And you are the only people I can turn to.
First I have Dmed/Refereed rpgs since 1990, and have played since 78'. My "old" gaming crew retunred to D&D after a 3 year break. Im running the new D20 system, 3.5 with the various asssociated problems etc. We were all 2nd ed. players..
Anyway. Seems to me that the campaign is just getting out of hand with non stop meta gaming, arguments, of all things 2nd GUESSING THE DM!
You see we're all 29+ in age and I now believe we're too smart for our own good. we only play once a month (which sux) and we play for 4-8 good solid hours...
As we all know DMing is a thankless job, and requires a big investment in time.
Sadly I have players counting move squares and telling me what i can do and cant do. Of course its all through the players perspective, and they assume that the rules are applied 100% the same for monsters and such.
My response has been a swift dismissal of question or concern, mainly because If I indulge the player, we have 5 arm chair DMs (who have never dmed) hypothessizing about decisions that they arent required to worry about.
Primarily, its caused me to be very defensive and my patience is shot. Seems like there isnt a single encounter that some one doesnt say "wait a minute?!?!?" Right in the middle of me describing the action/environment.
Im a "narative" minded DM, and several of the players are heavy "mechanical" players.
its to the point where Im saying," Well youre so F%$#@#$% smart why dont you run the game!. Buy the books,paint the leads, draw the maps, create the prestige clasesses..etc.etc.etc.
But I know the game will die a slow death under another DM. The other player that has run games, was Module Man, literally reading the module while we played, and setting down the map, with players pointing where they go... A lesser experience than what Im used to.
They so badly want to apply 2nd edition knowledge, it kills them. especially with "known" monsters. I have therefore started using "non Traditional" monsters, or archetypes. 3.5 rules give old monsters new capabilites as feats... The players just want to know WHY?
My thinking is"well solve this problem in game, and in character. Maybe the PC can research undead types in the church/librabry. Maybe you can seek out a sage?"...It just blows my mind. Especially when a PC is telling me how to run a MONSTER that I CREATED!...
My plan is as follows.
1. Meta game penalty increased to 1000 Xp or 1 level per offense!!
2. Only use non standard monsters, and change up the old ones
3. Outline at the beginning of the session that NOONE should tell the DM how to run a encounter
4. More closely enforce the "table the argument" till the end of the session...
Any hints would be helpful. I really like running the game, and its just reaching a nice point in the campaign. But with the Fun:non fun ratio changes it will self destruct anyhow.
Many of these issue are soooo rudinmentary. 1 player even believes that he should have a chance to see enemies approaching from BEHIND?!?!?
One of my players even called me a M.F.er which is totally out of hand...
thx
I'm gonna start with that I am fairly new to DMing, but I am very familiar with these problems. I've been DMing for almost 2 years now, and I encountered some of the same problems as you when I began.
First off, make sure you talk to the Players about any and all concerns you might have. DM-to-Player communication is the solution is the problem to most any DM-to-Player problem. You may be able to work something out with them.
It sounds like your Players are trying to be back-seat-drivers of the game. Since they seem compelled to run the game themselves, you might try letting people take turns behind the screen. I'm not sure how experienced the others are as far as DMing goes, but Players often misunderstand the difficulties of DMing, including preparation time and the ability to actually run a game session well. And if your Players see how crummy some of the others are at DMing, they might respect you as DM more.
1. In-game repercussions for out-of-game behavior should be done very rarely, if at all. If there's a problem out-of-game, it's best to handle it out-of-game. So, this might not be the best idea, and could add more tension.
2. I'm not sure of the purpose of this. If your group likes and is more familiar with the 2E monsters, you might just use those monsters, and adjust them a little to fit with 3E.
3. Be careful how you say this. You don't want to come across as a dictator of the game. You could explain to your Players that they need to just trust your judgment as DM, to do their jobs as Players and to let you do your job as DM. You could explain to them that this would be best to avoid tension in the game.
4. Not sure what you mean with this. If it regards arguments at the table, perhaps this may be best for your group. You could explain to them that there should not be arguing at the table, to prevent tension and to keep the game moving. Then again, there are some groups that prefer to discuss things with the rules on the spot. If it's out-right challenging your decisions as DM, they shouldn't ever be doing that.
Again, you might allow your Players to try out their DMing skills every once in a while. Or, you might get them more involved in the adventures, letting them control some of the NPC's. It might be interesting for the Players to be controlling the PC's
and the group of orcs that they are fighting. That is, unless your group will blame each other for what damage an NPC they control inflicts to their character.
In short, tell them to knock off all the crap. It's a game, and it needs to be fun. Tell them that they are making things unfun for you and probably each other.
