The Genetics of Evil

[Femerus the Gnecro]

To each his own, though I think Evil is Evil.

What about a baby who was Vamp-ed? What if it was your own child?

I think you're missing my point. I'm referring to races (note the use of the term 'race', as in species) that are seen as inherantly evil in the DnD world.

I disagree that species (note the term again) should be automatically assumed to be evil from birth. The very idea of a member of a sentient species being born 'evil' seems awfully naive to me.

Thus, undead, not being a true 'race' or 'species' in and of themselves, are totally irrelevant to this conversation.

That being said, hell yes undead are evil. Smite the crap out of 'em. If my baby was turned into a vamp, I'd stake it, burn it, gather up the dust and go get it ressed.

-F

 

[LostSoul]

I think you're missing my point. I'm referring to races (note the use of the term 'race', as in species) that are seen as inherantly evil in the DnD world.

Okay, I gotcha.

My point, though, is that Evil is Evil. It don't matter if it's a rock or a Ghoul; it's Evil, and should be destroyed. If the "race" is Evil, as the DM says, then it should be destroyed. Or at least bred out of existence.

 

[Femerus the Gnecro]

Heh. evil rocks.

-F

edit: this is silly, I know. But I just realized that someone might actually take offense at that statement.

Let me clarify. I'm not saying that 'evil' rocks, as in EVIL ROCKS! WHOO HOO!

I'm just very amused by the idea of an evil rock. Like... Ooo, watch out for that pebble, he runs with a bad crowd.

God... let's hope today's 'evil thread' silliness doesn't last all weekend.

 

[Xarlen]

Hey, aren't there documentations of Good liches, and vampires, and stuffs? Like, in Magic of Faerun, there IS a good lich template.

Or, maybe it's just my angst/WoD/Pop culture mindsight.

 

[cptg1481]

Re: Re: The Genetics of Evil

What is the controversy?

I don't see a problem with it.

The one time I have had a player complain something about this, I made the following clear:

Elves, dwarves, goblins, drow, and etc are not human. They are not a ethnicity of human. Their minds don't work like a human.

Yes, humans come in all shades of good/evil/neutral, but that is what is special about humanity. Free will.

The difference between races is more then height and how pointy are their ears.

Of course, with every campeign I toss the races into different roles/situations. It keeps things interesting.

FD

I don't understand this at all, so are all elven characters in your game CG, and all dwarves LG or do players have the volition to choose?

Do elven and dwarven PC's lack free will?

If so how are they viable options for PC races?

I want free will I guess I'll have to be human......

 

[Zappo]

I think that giving Orcs and the like an "Always" alignment is perfectly acceptable. Very Tolkienesque, if you ask me.

Keep in mind that an "Always" alignment doesn't mean literally "Always"... it has a certain oddball factor built-in. Like, one in a thousand, or one in a hundred thousand, or a hundred million., but it sill is there.

IMC, I reason that for Prime Material creatures an "Always" alignment means "One in a hundred is not of that alignment, one in a hundred of those is of an opposite alignment". For planar "exemplar" creatures, which are literally made of their alignment, I estimate that maybe one in a million has an alignment one step from the one indicated, and just a handful in the entire race history has (or has had) a radically different alignment.

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Re: Re: Re: The Genetics of Evil

I want free will I guess I'll have to be human......

heh, You are not in my game- so you don't have to worry about it.

I don't understand this at all, so are all elven characters in your game CG, and all dwarves LG or do players have the volition to choose?

Ok, some light examples, in my current campeign- dwarves are based off late medieval Italy. Powerful merchant families and the church are involved in many levels of intrigue- all trying to control a small area of land. Politics and social backstabbing is common - and the only way to advance in their society.

The basic alignment of dwarves is LE.
Players have the option of any corollary alignment: LE, LN, NE, TN

Elves are literally a race of legend- their entire religion revolves around stories of their past. Their "gods" are their past heroes and villians. The only way to get into the afterlife is to live a life worthy of stories- otherwise you are reincarnated as an elf to try again, as you are if your story is forgotten. Bards are the most respected figure in their society- they act as priests, judges, and educators.

Their laws are very light- and basically revolve around "do unto others..". They have little respect for authority and have dealt with centuries of invasion.

The basic alignment of elves is CN.
Players have the option of any corollary alignment: CN, CG, NG, TN, NE, CE

As I said- in each campeign this changes.
In my last one elves had disappeared, dwarves were NG, and goblins were LE (which is how we had a TN gob druid pc).

Do elven and dwarven PC's lack free will?

Within the context of their race- they have as much freedom as that allows. They are not human- you would never see an elven or dwarven paladin in my current campeign.

It is not because an elf would not want to become a paladin, it is not in their nature to even consider it an option. They can not want to become a paladin.

It would be like bringing your goldfish to the park and trying to get it to go fetch your frisbee. It is just beyond the ability of the goldfish.

If so how are they viable options for PC races?

I make their culture and society interesting- my players seem to like it.

Personally, I don't understand how a dm could shrug their shoulders and say all races act just like humans. Why bother having the other races at all?

But, I don't play in their games, so it is not my concern.

Respectfully submitted
FD

 

[barsoomcore]

Re: Re: Re: Re: The Genetics of Evil

Personally, I don't understand how a dm could shrug their shoulders and say all races act just like humans. Why bother having the other races at all?

I have a lot of sympathy for this point of view. Ergo, I don't have non-humans in my game.

...

Well, obviously, there's lots of things that aren't human. Dogs and cats and duckbilled platypuses...

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The Genetics of Evil

and duckbilled platypuses...

I guess you are running Toon if you are allowing such nonsence monsters..

FD