D&D 5E (2024) The Great Wizard Extinction.

[Stalker0]

Yes. Frequent. If you are being hit. Wisdom saves can easily instantly snap out your concentration in fights that matter. Actually, one should really look at fights that matter. Enemy spellcasters are usually in those fights. Illithids are in those fights.

I think its a reasonable statement to make that there are far far more enemies that deal damage than deliver int or wisdom saving throws.

And while you could absolutely run a game just chock full of Illithid...I hope we can agree that is not the typical dnd game.

Now I am in the camp that says the wizard is just fine, but I do think when it comes to saving throws the con bonus for the sorc is a bonus on top of what the wizard gets.

 

[Zardnaar]

Yes, not sure why that is controversial or makes some point you think it makes? Sorcerers very often also dip a Paladin level for armor. Since when is a full-caster armor-dip an unknown thing to you? Almost all full casters have the identical issue with AC.

Erm Druids and Clerics get armor, dragon sorcerer gets cha+dexterity to AC.

 

[Zardnaar]

Its offensive that Wizards or Sorcerers can cast and wear armor anyway, or mix Spell Slots between Arcane and Divine!

More multiclassing changes things.

Even then cha based classes have more options and there's two full caster wisdom classes and 1 half caster.

 

[Zardnaar]

I think its a reasonable statement to make that there are far far more enemies that deal damage than deliver int or wisdom saving throws.

And while you could absolutely run a game just chock full of Illithid...I hope we can agree that is not the typical dnd game.

Now I am in the camp that says the wizard is just fine, but I do think when it comes to saving throws the con bonus for the sorc is a bonus on top of what the wizard gets.

Everything deals damage reasonably few things castspells comparatively.

And im also saying clerics and druids have better wisdom saves than Wizards. And are better earlier on.

 

[Amphytrion]

In my last session, the players fought an NPC Archmage. They weren't pleased to find that not only did she have Magic Resistance, but was also resistant to spell damage! "How come she gets that?"

"Well, she's an Archmage."

"Funny, I don't see an option for that in the Wizard class."

But it really does sound like something a Wizard should be able to get.

But the Wizard can get those features. It’s the 14th-level feature of the School of Abjuration.

The Archmage is simply an 18th-level abjurer (assuming you are referring to 2014 rules).

 

[Zardnaar]

But the Wizard can get those features. It’s the 14th-level feature of the School of Abjuration.

The Archmage is simply an 18th-level abjurer (assuming you are referring to 2014 rules).

Nice.

Wizards get some nice 10+ features.

Its the level 3, 6 stuff I find underwhelming/boring.

 

[TwoSix]

OK roleplaying time.

Youre going into a campaign blind. Unfamiliar DM. Its set on FR. That's all you know.

Game starts at level 3 let's go with that.

Unfamiliar DM and Tier 1, probably not going squishy caster. Gotta see how the DM deals with stuff first.

 

[Amphytrion]

Nice.

Wizards get some nice 10+ features.

Its the level 3, 6 stuff I find underwhelming/boring.

I agree with you in general (as I mentioned earlier in the thread), and I fully concur that levels 1-10 matter much more than later levels.

I think the biggest issue is that the class doesn’t quite fulfill the promise of its fantasy and players tend to find it an underwhelming experience.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Nice.

Wizards get some nice 10+ features.

Its the level 3, 6 stuff I find underwhelming/boring.

Illusionists get decent stuff. Minor illusion as a bonus at 3 is genuinely good and two free summons per day is ... worse than morphing illusions but a decent bridge.

 

[Zardnaar]

Unfamiliar DM and Tier 1, probably not going squishy caster. Gotta see how the DM deals with stuff first.

Yup exactly.