D&D 5E The Greatest Thing about 5e

Stalker0

Legend
So I've been running 5e for a long while now, but recently got a chance to play in some 3.5 and pathfinder campaigns.

I really cut my teeth on 3.0/3.5, having started my gaming career at the very end of the 2e era. And there were certain things I missed. However, there is one thing that 5e does that is so simple....and yet it is AMAZING how much difference and improvement it brings to the game. It is so incredibly powerful that I honestly found it hard to play without.

And that is..... the fluidity of movement.

The fact that 5e lets you move, do an action, and move again. The fact that you can move, attack, move, attack. The fact that you can manipulate an object for free, such as open a door while moving....it is literally game changing.

Playing 3.5/Pathfinder again, there are some things I miss. But man combat feels like your standing still, it is soooo rigid. The fact that you have to drop a weapon instead of putting it away because it would take a move action, you can't just pick up a weapon, you can't move ten feet and get two attacks. Its also funny how often players seem to forget that rule too. I watched in two different games players routinely forget how a 5 foot step works, and seemed shocked that they couldn't move 10 feet and fire a bow twice (and these were veteran players!).


Though I don't agree with every direction 5e has taken, I can say without a shadow of a doubt, that the changes to movement are HUGE improvements. So much so that if I ever do go back and run a 3.5 again, I will houserule some version of it back in, because now having tasted the superior method, going back to the old way is almost unbearable.
 

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ReadyButNot

Explorer
ngl, when i started playing ttrpgs with 4e and learned about move actions, i was utterly bewildered when my dm asked me if i had an ability that let me move both before and after taking an action - i'd simply assumed that so long as i had movement i could still move. it's not just rigid, it's horrifically unintuitive. i think the group at least somewhat agreed, because we ended that campaign early to play 5e.
 


ReadyButNot

Explorer
DND5 dynamic wars of movement.
well, not quite - things are still fairly stop and start due to opportunity attacks if you don't have a way to disengage as a bonus action (or just not an action). a lot more fluid and intuitive then other systems though.
i'm currently in a pf2 campaign though we haven't gotten far enough to have combat - i'm wondering how opportunity attacks being limited to certain classes will end up changing combat.
 

well, not quite - things are still fairly stop and start due to opportunity attacks if you don't have a way to disengage as a bonus action (or just not an action). a lot more fluid and intuitive then other systems though.
i'm currently in a pf2 campaign though we haven't gotten far enough to have combat - i'm wondering how opportunity attacks being limited to certain classes will end up changing combat.
I don't find in all the 5e I played that OAs slow up things. Often tactical to provoke one so a fellow team member won't do so.

Which makes me think of a third great point. It is much more of a team game then ever before, IME. Player A setting up for player B and player C.
 

Which makes me think of a third great point. It is much more of a team game then ever before, IME. Player A setting up for player B and player C.
I absolutely agree that the movement is better than ever but I have to say that 4e takes the cake when it comes to team mechanics. Your defenders actually did unique things to protect other PCs each round and leaders could boost other people as a minor action for short term buffs each turn. The warlord could just make other PCs do stuff without limited dice. I'll take 5e's simplicity of movement and 4e's tactics, if I'm picking and choosing.
 


tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
ngl, when i started playing ttrpgs with 4e and learned about move actions, i was utterly bewildered when my dm asked me if i had an ability that let me move both before and after taking an action - i'd simply assumed that so long as i had movement i could still move. it's not just rigid, it's horrifically unintuitive. i think the group at least somewhat agreed, because we ended that campaign early to play 5e.
I find that chsnge slows down combat a lot though & results in player turns constantly going like this typing on my phone simplified recap of an example:
I attack. Dies xx hit?
Yea roll damage
Yy for. You first attack
Ok you hit the ork & [$description]... . Is that your turn?
No I have more... How's he looking is he still alive, doing ok?
Do you want to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No but how's its life? ....
Do you have any wsy of innately knowing that or is that your turn?
No does xx hit?
Yep gimme damage
Yy
You hut the bad guy and [$description]
sigh would you like to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No I have a third attack but how's he doing?
Do you have any way of knowing that automatically without using an insight check as an action or something?
No but....
Tgen you stilldon't know this instant in the heat of battle finish your turn or ik moving on
Dies xx hit?
Yep gimme some damage.
Then repeat this cycle with that player every. single. round. whenever there are two monsters in reach or within reach of the remaining movement speed.
 

dave2008

Legend
well, not quite - things are still fairly stop and start due to opportunity attacks if you don't have a way to disengage as a bonus action (or just not an action). a lot more fluid and intuitive then other systems though.
OA don't stop people from moving IME. Monsters and PCs have so many HP that an OA or two is rarely a threat and healing is abundant enough that it isn't an issue at all for the next combat. But I am sure everyone plays differently.
i'm currently in a pf2 campaign though we haven't gotten far enough to have combat - i'm wondering how opportunity attacks being limited to certain classes will end up changing combat.
I have heard it, combined with the 3 action system, helps compared to 3e/PF, but not as much as the free movement in 5e.

Also, the lack of OAs available to PCs isn't the issue, it is the lack of OAs that monsters have that is the issue. Very few monsters have OA so player feel more free to run around I guess.
 
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dave2008

Legend
I agree in general. But imho the lack of interesting and varied abilities of monsters/opponents still leads to way too much stand-still-and-punch-sack-of-hp moments at all levels.
Then you should use interesting monsters/opponents. There is really not a lack of them, you just have to know where to look.
 

dave2008

Legend
I find that chsnge slows down combat a lot though & results in player turns constantly going like this typing on my phone simplified recap of an example:
I attack. Dies xx hit?
Yea roll damage
Yy for. You first attack
Ok you hit the ork & [$description]... . Is that your turn?
No I have more... How's he looking is he still alive, doing ok?
Do you want to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No but how's its life? ....
Do you have any wsy of innately knowing that or is that your turn?
No does xx hit?
Yep gimme damage
Yy
You hut the bad guy and [$description]
sigh would you like to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No I have a third attack but how's he doing?
Do you have any way of knowing that automatically without using an insight check as an action or something?
No but....
Tgen you stilldon't know this instant in the heat of battle finish your turn or ik moving on
Dies xx hit?
Yep gimme some damage.
Then repeat this cycle with that player every. single. round. whenever there are two monsters in reach or within reach of the remaining movement speed.
Yikes, we don't have that problem. 30 seconds is all you get to do everything on your turn. It has made our combats fast, furious, more fun, and gotten rid of the silliness you describe. We started that in 4e and loved it so much we still do it in 5e.
 

ReadyButNot

Explorer
I don't find in all the 5e I played that OAs slow up things. Often tactical to provoke one so a fellow team member won't do so.

Which makes me think of a third great point. It is much more of a team game then ever before, IME. Player A setting up for player B and player C.
i didn't say it was slow, i said it was start and stop. an interesting point though.
[...]
Then repeat this cycle with that player every. single. round. whenever there are two monsters in reach or within reach of the remaining movement speed.
i...have...never had this issue. i think this is just an issue with your players. i don't even really understand why they'd bother checking - it's not like it'll ever matter, they'd still need to put down that enemy to get away from it without an oa.
OA don't stop people from moving IME. Monsters and PCs have so many HP that an OA or two is rarely a threat and healing is abundant enough that it isn't an issue at all for the next combat. But I am sure everyone plays differently.
they are a discouragement which was my point. they can also get fairly nasty depending on the enemy.
I have heard it, combined with the 3 action system, helps compared to 3e/PF, but not as much as the free movement in 5e.
guess i'll find out how much eventually...
 

HaroldTheHobbit

Adventurer
Then you should use interesting monsters/opponents. There is really not a lack of them, you just have to know where to look.
Imho there is a lack of them in the WotC material, even if you imply that I don't know where to look.

It's not a problem for me personally, since I homebrew my monster/opponent abilities with inspiration from other editions and game systems.

But for newer DMs and players this might be a thing that over time lessens the fun factor, and is detrimental to the game and hobby as a whole.
 

Plaguescarred

D&D Playtester for WoTC since 2012
Yeah 5E's fluidity of movement is something i liked at first sight during early alpha playtesting phase of its development. It makes everything flow more naturally and another significant related change is Opportunity Attack triggering only when leaving reach and not when leaving a space/square within it, also increasing fluidity of movement on the battlefield considerably. I think this is here to stay.
 

DND_Reborn

Legend
I never played much 3E (and no 4E at all), but when I played I never recalled movement feeling any more stop/go as it does in 5E. Creatures usually move to a position and act, and only sometimes move more since they can accomplish what they want from that position.

In fact, our Cinematic Initiative added Move actions back into the system for 5E. Now, you can do multiple moves, so that is probably why it hasn't created any issue. 🤷‍♂️

Anyway, I'm glad the movement aspect of 5E appeals to you and makes your games better. :)
 


Yaarel

Mind Mage
I find that chsnge slows down combat a lot though & results in player turns constantly going like this typing on my phone simplified recap of an example:
I attack. Dies xx hit?
Yea roll damage
Yy for. You first attack
Ok you hit the ork & [$description]... . Is that your turn?
No I have more... How's he looking is he still alive, doing ok?
Do you want to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No but how's its life? ....
Do you have any wsy of innately knowing that or is that your turn?
No does xx hit?
Yep gimme damage
Yy
You hut the bad guy and [$description]
sigh would you like to spend the rest of your turn determining that?
No I have a third attack but how's he doing?
Do you have any way of knowing that automatically without using an insight check as an action or something?
No but....
Tgen you stilldon't know this instant in the heat of battle finish your turn or ik moving on
Dies xx hit?
Yep gimme some damage.
Then repeat this cycle with that player every. single. round. whenever there are two monsters in reach or within reach of the remaining movement speed.
"Fresh" (full hp) to "fatiguing" to "bloodied" (half hp) to "dropping ones guard" to "downed" (0 hp): these categories are reasonably "innate" for any character to notice during a combat.
 

Yaarel

Mind Mage
Also the 5e limit of only one opportunity attack per reaction, is a game changer.

Not only does it feel more realistic that one person can distract an opponent while a teammate slips past, the per-reaction limit turns out to make Large player characters balanced options.
 

"Fresh" (full hp) to "fatiguing" to "bloodied" (half hp) to "dropping ones guard" to "downed" (0 hp): these categories are reasonably "innate" for any character to notice during a combat.
I've taken the approach that characters only fall over on their turn. You can't tell whether they're about to fall.
 

Yaarel

Mind Mage
I've taken the approach that characters only fall over on their turn. You can't tell whether they're about to fall.
I assume player characters can still easily see when the fatiguing opponent is dropping ones guard enough to get bloodied.

One can watch any reallife fight sport to see when one is getting sloppy from fatigue, and starting to get "bloodied" (= ½ total hp) from leaving ones guard open.

A knockout (= 0 hp) leaves the opponent completely defenseless and killable. But a sport, of course, wont go for a kill.

Heh, except in my setting, where the Feywild eladrin have an annual Revelry sacred festival, when mages duel to the death, the dead loser gets resurrected after the game.
 
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