The harder, the better - dm

[Bran Mak Morn]

I think you should have added a "mwa-ha-ha-ha!" at the end of this.

mwa-ha-ha-ha! IS my favourite expression!

 

[Bran Mak Morn]

Um....you mean kill his character, right?

RIGHT! The one he has been carefully preparing for the previous 14 days, that one! That will never be more than your 1 year long campaign preparation....


THIS THREAD IS POLEMIC ON PURPOSE JUST TO HAVE SOME SINCERE CONSIDERATIONS ON BAD PLAYERS

 

[Vayden]

Ranger w/ two bastard swords? Hey, it's over the top, but whatever.

Trying to use eldritch blast on statues to see if they're monsters? Trying to re-charge encounters mid-encounter? Your initial post was correct - those people are ***(deleted for the sake of Eric's Grandma)*** and there's no point in playing with them unless you have to. If you have to play with them, tell them to shape up, or else start killing them off.

 

[gizmo33]

I much prefer just finding some way to abuse the rule or decision against them. If a player tries to abuse the system in a way that can make the game not fun for others, then it's only fair that the DM gets to do the same to him.

Though, yeah, talking to the player first might be the better idea. I guess. Humpf.

IMO you guess correctly. In fact, before the DM would even talk with the player I would recommend getting his own house in order first. Which means two things:

(1) think about whether or not there is a reasonable house-rule or re-interpretation of the rule that can fix the problem, and

(2) get over whatever self-esteem issues are driving the need for the DM to show he's more "powerful" than the players. The DM's job is different than the players - you're not supposed to use all that "power" to show how cool you are because you can kill some PC in your game. And I would think that the "others" that you're worried about who are not happy with the actions of the player in question aren't suddenly going to be thrilled when the game turns into some grudge-match between the DM and the player.

IMO the DM should really expect players to be advocates for their characters to an extent that they aren't going to appreciate a guilt-trip about their tactics. If, for example, a player discovers that his character can stand at the top of a cliff and throw rocks down at the monsters and kill them all without risk to the PC then you can pretty much expect him to do just that. I wouldn't take it as a mark of disrespect that the player doesn't ask your permission first.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Hi there,

obviously it is possible to speak with the player and YES it is the first thing to do. MAYBE.

I've been at the 4th Edition launch in Italy and there I've met some of the (archetype) players I'm referring to. People who cast Eldritch Blast on every sinlge statue, furniture and corridor they see just to be sure they'll not lose some hp in the way, who ask the DM: "When does an encounter finish?" "Well, let's say if there's at least 1 non combat round" "Ok then, what if I stun all the monsters and then I wait one round? Do I get my encounter powers back?", who don't give a s+++t if they use a rule for a purpose that was obviously not forseen by the Manual and that give some kind of odd result, perfectly consistent with the rules but not with reality. Yes I'm talking about the twin bastard swords and the ranger. The ranger? he shouldn't even know what a bastard sword is!

Anyway, don't want to bother you guys, but as long as I agree that the DM stuff is to keep things funny and enjoying, the LONG preparation, the efforts, the study beyond the 5 hours session should be repaid by players too.

It sounds like there are clashing playstyles at work here. Some (or one or all) of your players are testing the limits of a new set of game mechanics. If there is nothing preventing a character from using an at-will ability then why wouldn't they use it? Powers and resources are only as precious as the rules and game environment make them. What is given freely in unlimited quantity will be used without thought or consideration. You seem to expect a player to not make use of everything at thier disposal to ensure survival and success. That is more "unreal" than any attempt to use the rules to an advantage.

Ok I completely miss the point where a ranger wouldn't know what a bastard sword is. Are these exotic rare weapons in your game world? Would a fighter know what one is? It sounds like the ranger found a very effective weapon combo.

I think you may be dissappointed with D&D if you hope for the rules to model any sort of reality. The rules are simply a resolution mechanic and do not model reality at all.

 

[Eluxis]

Yessir

In my campaigns, you get one attempt to abuse the rules with liberal interpretations of the RAW.

After the first warning, if you insist on trying to be a shifty, rules-lawyering d-bag, I'll show you the door.

You can go mourn over the corpse of 3.5 with the powergaming fanboys.

 

[pogminky]

People who cast Eldritch Blast on every sinlge statue, furniture and corridor they see just to be sure they'll not lose some hp in the way,

What???
Player "I eldritch blast it"
DM "Illegal target. Fatal Bus Drive Error. Insert Brain B. Please try again."

who ask the DM: "When does an encounter finish?" "Well, let's say if there's at least 1 non combat round" "Ok then, what if I stun all the monsters and then I wait one round? Do I get my encounter powers back?",

Player: "Do I....."
DM "No. Next question."
Player "But the rules say..."
DM "No. K - next players turn."

If all else fails sneak attack the dude's scrotum with a copy of the Middle Earth Encyclopaedia.

 

[Corwin]

OK, now just hold on a sec there...

"When does an encounter finish?" "Well, let's say if there's at least 1 non combat round" "Ok then, what if I stun all the monsters and then I wait one round? Do I get my encounter powers back?"...

There is a big difference between an encounter "ending" (which may very well be a round after combat ends in some cases), and getting encounter powers back. You need to complete a short rest (a minimum of 5 minutes) to reset your encounter powers.

So it seems a simple answer to his question. Why did this get you so worked up? Is it that neither of you knew this rule? In which case, it was a simple misunderstanding by both of you. Easily to remedy.

...who don't give a s+++t if they use a rule for a purpose that was obviously not forseen by the Manual and that give some kind of odd result, perfectly consistent with the rules but not with reality.

Did you ask if they are doing it because they don't "give a s+++"? Or maybe they just have a different sensibility about what is or isn't consistent with the rules/reality of the game environment.

Yes I'm talking about the twin bastard swords and the ranger. The ranger? he shouldn't even know what a bastard sword is!

Ah. So are we talking about your personal, biased, and quite possibly close-minded, opinion of the ranger class here? Is that what this is about? I'm sorry if you have players who want to play the character they imagined. And not something of your tastes.

Would I be allowed to play my dwarf ranger who wields two battleaxes in your games? Or am I a big, rules-monkey jerk too? Just curious. Should rangers know what a battleaxe is either?

Anyway, I've got a simple suggestion. Why don't you just build all the PCs yourself and hand them out to the players before the game? That way none of them offend your sensibilities.

Seriously.

 

[firesnakearies]

IF NOT POSSIBLE (he's a friend? he owns the house? His GF is amazingly cute?)

This made me grin.

 

[Oompa]

In my campaigns, you get one attempt to abuse the rules with liberal interpretations of the RAW.

After the first warning, if you insist on trying to be a shifty, rules-lawyering d-bag, I'll show you the door.

You can go dry hump the corpse of 3.5 with the powergaming fanboys.

Well stun lasts for one round i think.. and to get encounter powers back you need to rest for 5 minutes.. or make the monsters immune for stun and for blasting all objects.. hey suddenly they have an resist 100 all...

There are easier solutions than killing off an character..