The King that Crawls

ZenBear

Villager
Does anyone know if Torog is still canonical for 5th Edition? I name-dropped him in my campaign for the Halloween session, where a Chain Devil chased my party of 4th level characters through the Underdark when they happened across it during its pilgrimage down The King's Highway. I'm curious if I could add him in a story I'm writing that I intend to be as canonically accurate as I can make it.
 
Mike Mearls made him a demon lord for his homebrew 5e Nethir Vale game. If your concern was bringing him to FR without conflicting with the setting's canon, that is what I would suggest ("natural" portals in the Underdark that bring you to his layer of the Abyss, which just looks like the Underdark). Even in as chronicled a setting as FR, there must be a bunch of big demons who haven't been named (it's a big universe, and they haven't turned their attention to the Realms yet).

That would be consistent with what they did with the Raven Queen and I think I saw something about Vecna being an archlich.....
 

SkidAce

Adventurer
Mike Mearls made him a demon lord for his homebrew 5e Nethir Vale game...

...That would be consistent with what they did with the Raven Queen and I think I saw something about Vecna being an archlich.....
I am tired of Mike Mearls et al spying on my home campaign and stealing all my good ideas.
 

dave2008

Adventurer
Does anyone know if Torog is still canonical for 5th Edition? I name-dropped him in my campaign for the Halloween session, where a Chain Devil chased my party of 4th level characters through the Underdark when they happened across it during its pilgrimage down The King's Highway. I'm curious if I could add him in a story I'm writing that I intend to be as canonically accurate as I can make it.
There is not a single D&D "canon." Are you talking about Greyhawk, Forgotten Realms, Dark Sun, Eberron, Dragonlnace, Dawn War/Nentir Vale, etc. ?

As far as I know Torog was introduced in the 4e Dawn War / Nentir Vale setting. In 5e he is still listed as a god in the Dawn War setting, but there has been no official support for that setting other than mentioning it in the DMG. So I guess that means he is still canon in the Dawn War setting, but there is nothing official in 5e about him other than that.
 

ZenBear

Villager
Thanks everyone. I keep forgetting to specify the setting, but I’m asking about the Forgotten Realms. He’s a great tragic deity for my homebrew campaign setting, but I won’t be able to use him in my story. Oh well.
 

dave2008

Adventurer
Thanks everyone. I keep forgetting to specify the setting, but I’m asking about the Forgotten Realms. He’s a great tragic deity for my homebrew campaign setting, but I won’t be able to use him in my story. Oh well.
Is there a particular reason you will not be able to use him? There are many gods and other NPCs that where not a thing in Forgotten Realms, until suddenly they where (I'm looking at you Tiamat an Acererak). You could easily create a reason for Torog to appear in the Forgotten Realms. Heck in the Dawn War Cannon his tunnels went into the shadofell as well, might they also burst into Realmspace?
 

UnknownDyson

Explorer
Thanks everyone. I keep forgetting to specify the setting, but I’m asking about the Forgotten Realms. He’s a great tragic deity for my homebrew campaign setting, but I won’t be able to use him in my story. Oh well.
You know, you could make him an interloper deity in your FR campaign. An interloper deity is a god that has migrated to FR from another dimension/universe. See Mulhorand Pantheon (Supposed to actually be the Egyptian pantheon from our Earth), there is also the Chained God.
 
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pukunui

Adventurer
[MENTION=83242]dave2008[/MENTION]: Tiamat’s been around in FR since at least 2e. The old Cult of the Dragon sourcebook mentions that her followers were infiltrating the cult in an attempt to take it over. The 5e Tyranny of Dragons storyline shows that they ultimately succeeded. It just took them a really long time (and multiple edition changes).
 

dave2008

Adventurer
[MENTION=83242]dave2008[/MENTION]: Tiamat’s been around in FR since at least 2e. The old Cult of the Dragon sourcebook mentions that her followers were infiltrating the cult in an attempt to take it over. The 5e Tyranny of Dragons storyline shows that they ultimately succeeded. It just took them a really long time (and multiple edition changes).
Yep I skipped 2e and 3e, so anything that wasn't 1e, 4e, or 5e is non-canon to me! ;)
 

Azzy

Cyclone Ranger
[MENTION=83242]dave2008[/MENTION]: Tiamat’s been around in FR since at least 2e. The old Cult of the Dragon sourcebook mentions that her followers were infiltrating the cult in an attempt to take it over. The 5e Tyranny of Dragons storyline shows that they ultimately succeeded. It just took them a really long time (and multiple edition changes).
Yeah, Tiamat (and Bahamut) were always setting neutral and, as such, considered default for FR. It also doesn't hurt the Ed Greenwood wrote a definitive 2-part article on the Nine Hells in Dragon magazine in the 1e days (and Tiamat was the ruler of the first level of Hell at that time.
 
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Paul Farquhar

Adventurer
Taimat and Bahamut where in the (non-setting specific) 1st edition AD&D Monster Manual.

Forgotten Realms has hundreds of gods, adding one more isn't going to matter one way or the other.
 

dave2008

Adventurer
Yeah, Tiamat (and Bahamut) were always setting neutral and, as such, considered default for FR. It also doesn't hurt the Ed Greenwood wrote a definitive 2-part article on the Nine Hells in Dragon magazine in the 1e days (and Tiamat was the ruler of the first level of Hell at that time.
I would argue that setting neutral does not equal default FR. But as I've never played in FR, maybe that is just me.
 

Azzy

Cyclone Ranger
I would argue that setting neutral does not equal default FR. But as I've never played in FR, maybe that is just me.
I did way back in the day... one of the group's DMs really liked the setting. When the whole Time of Troubles happened in the switch to 2e, it just soured me on the setting.

Generally speaking, if it was setting neutral, it was in the Realms—as FR was supposed to be the generic setting, replacing Greyhawk when Gygax got ousted.
 

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