The "Mass" Spells

[Lucius Foxhound]

I'm trying to figure out the logic of the "Mass" spells (Mass Hates, Mass Suggestion, etc) in planning out independent spell research on some new spells. Here are the ones I can identify:

Seeming (Mass Change Self) translates a 1st level spell into a 5th level spell.

Mass Haste translates a 3rd level spell into a 6th level spell
Mass Suggestion translates a 3rd level spell into a 6th level spell
Mass Fly translates a 3rd level spell into a 6th level spell (although I think Monte puts it at 7th level in BOEM).

Mass Invisibility translates a 2nd level spell into a 7th level spell (??)
Mass Teleport translates a 5th level spell into a 7th level spell

Mass Charm translates a 4th level spell into an 8th level spell

Weird (Mass Phantasmal Killer) translates a 4th level spell into a 9th level spell.

There doesn't seem to be much logic too it. Mass Displacement seems logicially to go to 6th level (since it's a 3rd level spell), but I'm not sure.

But where would, for example, Mass Bull's Strength go? Or Mass Protection from Arrows? Any thoughts?

 

[gfunk]

The main problem is that all spells from previous editions kept the same level when 3rd edition came out. So we are often stuck with the logic that was originally used to place these spells.

If you want a good rules guideline, check out the Chain Spell feat from T&B. This will give you a good idea of which spells can be "massed." The level adjustment is +4.

 

[Jay Lofstead]

I have done some looking into this myself and did see a general pattern. It looks like a basic +3 levels with an adjustment by +/- 2 depending on the relative power of the adjustment (how does the effectiveness of the "mass" version compare to the base version).

Take Mass Teleport compared to Teleport. All it does is to double the weight that can be transported. As far as effectiveness goes, this is not as good as Mass Haste (which extends the number of creatures by your level).

If I were to make a "real" mass teleport, I'd want it to allow the touched creatures to teleport with the caster each using the minimal weight allowance for the teleport spell (with one target touched per caster level). This would be a +3 or +4 spell levels rather than just +2.

Mass Phantasmal Killer takes a single death effect and allows it to work against several members of a group (a LOT more effective). Making that one +5 makes sense.

Look at things from that angle and see where it gets you. I think you might agree. The confounding piece is that the mass versions are not all using the same relationship to their base counterparts and the effectiveness of the mass versions vary greatly compared to each other. It certainly isn't a fixed adjustment.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Mass Invisibility is an improvement of Invisibility Sphere, which is only one level above Invisibility. It's a special case, as both spells do the same (Invisibility for several people) with the difference of range.

Nonetheless, it does depend on the spell.

Mass Bull's Strength (or Cat's Grace, or Endurance) would by alright at 5th. It's something like Fly, or Haste, giving a benefit for a set amount of time.

Mass Protection from Arrows depends whether the protection stays where it is (100 points max) or rises (150, 200?) and whether it is those 100 (150....) points for every single target or pooled for all. If you have 100 points, distributed amongst all targets, it would be a 3rd-level spell, 4th at the hightest. A mass version where they get their own points, and a little more (say, 150), would be 5th or 6th.

Mass displacement at 6th I'd say

 

[Archer]

Mass Bull's Strength (aka Bear's Heart) and Mass Endurance (aka Legion's March) are both 5th level spells so the +3 levels for mass seems to be right with a number of targets equal to caster level.

Aura of Vengeance is a double power, double area Prayer spell which is 2 levels higher and follows the pattern of mass teleport being double effect for 2 levels higher.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I introduced a Mass Spell metamagic feat with a level adjustment of +3. Worked fine so far.

Regards,

 

[Jens]

Mass Bull's Strength (aka Bear's Heart) and Mass Endurance (aka Legion's March) are both 5th level spells so the +3 levels for mass seems to be right with a number of targets equal to caster level.

... I haven't heard of the spells you mention. Are they official/where are they from?