The new Battlerager - Clear as mud

[JiffyPopTart]

I just broke my battleraging dwarf out of retirement due to my paladin being in chains....and I am trying to wrap my head around the new battlerager rules, which are as complicated as the old ones.

Pertinent facts:
I have a CON modifier of +4
I have the Dwarven Stoneblood feat and am 11th level

Are all these scenarios correct?

1. If I hit someone with an invigorating keyword attack I get 8thp which stack with whatever thps I already have.

2. If I hit someone with a non-invigorating keyword attack I get 4thp which do not stack.

3. If I miss everyone with an invigorating keyword attack I get 4thp which do stack.

4. If I miss with a non-invigorating keyword attack I get bupkis.

Thanks in advance
DS

 

[UngeheuerLich]

1. is wrong

You get extra hp equal to your constituton modifier if you hit and if the power gives you thp (like every invigorating power if you have endurance skilled) those stack.

3. also wrong

they don´t stack.

 

[WalterKovacs]

1. You would get 12 thp. 4 from the invigorating keyword, 4 from the feat and 4 from the battlerager class features. This does not stack with existing thp (that was the original build). Instead, you get to add the battlerager thp to any thp you would normally get from a power (including invigorating)

2. 4 thp is correct (unless of course, you get thp for that power already)

3. 4 thp is correct as well, although again, it will not stack.

4. Missing with a non-invigorating power does not interact with the battlerager class feature, so 0 thp (unless a different feat or power says otherwise of course).

 

[Bayuer]

3. 4 thp is correct as well, although again, it will not stack.

Shouldn't it be +8? +4 CON and +4 from feat? The feat description doesn't mention anything about being hit, but just about using invigorating power.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

Shouldn't it be +8? +4 CON and +4 from feat? The feat description doesn't mention anything about being hit, but just about using invigorating power.

It says to increase the number of thp you get for using invigorating powers by +4. The text for invigorating powers says you get +CON thp whenever you hit with the power, not just for using the power. Thus you should get +CON+4 thp whenever you hit.

A regular fighter would get nothing on a miss with an invigorating power, but a battlerager gets +CON as a consolation prize.

I am not sure how I missed out on the 12thp with an invigorating hit...that's some bad math on my part. I wish the power cards would append things like this on their statlines.

DS

 

[JiffyPopTart]

So to review all the data....

NOTHING STACKS

Hit-Invigorating=12thp
Hit-Regular=4thp
Miss-Invigorating=4thp
Miss-Regular=Nothing

I think I have a handle on it now. It will actually be easier to keep track of than the old thp bank I used to have running....once I write this on the power cards to keep it all straight in the heat of battle.

DS

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

So to review all the data....

NOTHING STACKS

Hit-Invigorating=12thp
Hit-Regular=4thp
Miss-Invigorating=4thp
Miss-Regular=Nothing

I think I have a handle on it now. It will actually be easier to keep track of than the old thp bank I used to have running....once I write this on the power cards to keep it all straight in the heat of battle.

DS

Sounds correct. It is easier to use the new battlerager and also they are much more encouraged in the new version to be offensive vs the old version that basically just wanted to be mobbed by as many melee opponents as possible. It also encourages you to be effective at OAs and CC attacks more since they represent another potential source of thp. Relatively speaking it also seems like invigorating powers are more worthwhile, but I haven't really played with the new version and worked all that out. Mostly they just no longer totally nerf all melee monsters.

 

[Blackbrrd]

I have a Battlevigor Fighter in the party I DM and he is very solid. Extremely solid defense and quite nice offensively. The character has Crushing surge to use when he needs temp hp and uses Brash Strike if he wants to drop something.

Compared to the other defenders he feels much more solid. I really love the ability to switch to a striker-ish power (Brash Strike) when the situation calls for it. Often used to finish off mobs and when high on temp hp.

 

[Bayuer]

It says to increase the number of thp you get for using invigorating powers by +4. The text for invigorating powers says you get +CON thp whenever you hit with the power, not just for using the power. Thus you should get +CON+4 thp whenever you hit.

A regular fighter would get nothing on a miss with an invigorating power, but a battlerager gets +CON as a consolation prize.

I am not sure how I missed out on the 12thp with an invigorating hit...that's some bad math on my part. I wish the power cards would append things like this on their statlines.

DS

It also says that: "If you use an invigorating fighter attack power and miss every target with it, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier."

Then the feat says: "You gain a +2 feat bonus to the number of temporary hit points you gain from using an invigorating power. The bonus increases to 4 at 11th level and 6 at 21st level."

I don't see here any requiment that says "when you hit", but only when you use. So when you miss you add feat bonus too.

 

[Minigiant]

It also says that: "If you use an invigorating fighter attack power and miss every target with it, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier."

Then the feat says: "You gain a +2 feat bonus to the number of temporary hit points you gain from using an invigorating power. The bonus increases to 4 at 11th level and 6 at 21st level."

I don't see here any requiment that says "when you hit", but only when you use. So when you miss you add feat bonus too.

Invigorating
If you are trained in Endurance, you gain temporary
hit points equal to your Constitution modifier when
you hit with a power that has the invigorating keyword...

You have to hit to gain THPs from invigorating powers. So you can't gain bonus THP unless you hit to get the regular THPs.