The stupid part of all of this...

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
The thing that quite frankly is the dumbest thing about this whole debacle (and this has been mentioned a number of times before in other threads)... is that WotC didn't even need to worry about or bother with the OGL in the first place. If their 3DVTT works well if/when it comes out, people will sign up to use it and spend all kinds of cash on the bells and whistles within it even if there are other 3rd party books and RPGs out there based on various editions of D&D or not.

People spent their money on D&D Insider because it was a really good series of programs to go along with 4E. People spend their money on D&D Beyond because it's a really great program to go along with 5E. People spend their money on the DMs Guild because there are really good products there to buy to go along with 5E. And people will spend money on the 3DVTT if it turns out it is also a really great program to go along with 2024E. WotC is going to get their money. That was always going to be true.

The idea that they thought they had to corner the market on D&D and D&D-adjacent material to make sure that was going to be the case was silly-- and if I had to guess, most likely it was all the employees who were not actually familiar with the D&D / 3rd Party ecology. It's too bad those within the company who know the ecology were not able to really drive the fact home that just being Wizards of the Coast-- producers of Dungeons & Dragons, the World's Most Popular Roleplaying Game-- would be more than enough to bring in the cash they all want to see.

And what's even more ridiculous is that (if we assume for the sake of argument the 3DVTT actually ends up working well)... in 18 months WotC will be in the exact same position of celebration of the 50th Anniversary and this whole thing will be in almost everyone's rear window. Games will be made, games will be played, and the 2024E books and 3DVTT will release to great fanfare-- with the only difference being a LOT of jokes at Wizard's expense made during the celebration. But of course... since jokes don't affect the bottom line... they will be easy jokes for folks at WotC to take.

By this time next year, we'll all be looking back on all of this (both gamers and employees within WotC) and thinking what a massive waste of time this all was in January 2023.
 

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Retreater

Legend
would be more than enough to bring in the cash they all want to see.
Hasbro is demanding to see $1Billion a year. D&D isn't even close to that under its current state, which is the largest it's ever been.
Based on the calls, Hasbro is planning to put "smaller IPs" (maybe including D&D) into hibernation.
What've been witnessing was Wizards making a desperate push to get the money to pay off the parent company.
The Creative Commons SRD is a last gift to the fans from the design team before it's put on life support.
 



mellored

Hero
Hasbro is demanding to see $1Billion a year. D&D isn't even close to that under its current state, which is the largest it's ever been.
The whole table top industry combined is even close to $1 Billion.

If Hasbro wants that kind of money they need to pull a Marvel. And Marvel doesn't make money on comics, they make it off the movies.

And DnD is plenty ripe for a big movie thing. You can make sequel after sequel just fine.
 


Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Hasbro is demanding to see $1Billion a year.

You say that as if it is a pipe dream. WotC brought in $1.3 billion in revenue in 2021. Asking for WotC to hit a mark they've hit before isn't crazy. It might be ambitious given changing economic circumstances, but it isn't whackadoo.

D&D isn't even close to that under its current state, which is the largest it's ever been.

Now, the idea that Hasbro demands $1 billion per brand is an assertion that calls for a cite from a reliable news source. No Hasbro brand does that.
 



Hasbro is demanding to see $1Billion a year. D&D isn't even close to that under its current state, which is the largest it's ever been.
Based on the calls, Hasbro is planning to put "smaller IPs" (maybe including D&D) into hibernation.
What've been witnessing was Wizards making a desperate push to get the money to pay off the parent company.
The Creative Commons SRD is a last gift to the fans from the design team before it's put on life support.

Maybe. Probably not. And even if. 5e started on life support and was a big success.
Still probably not. Even if DdD is not doing billions. It is more profitable than most other Hasbro Brands.
 

Dausuul

Legend
Hasbro is demanding to see $1Billion a year. D&D isn't even close to that under its current state, which is the largest it's ever been.
Based on the calls, Hasbro is planning to put "smaller IPs" (maybe including D&D) into hibernation.
What've been witnessing was Wizards making a desperate push to get the money to pay off the parent company.
The Creative Commons SRD is a last gift to the fans from the design team before it's put on life support.
That is highly unlikely. D&D is not the giant moneymaker that Magic is, but it's bringing in a very respectable income stream, enough that they were willing to drop $146 million to buy D&D Beyond. They are not going to shut it down unless it completely tanks.

It's the rest of Hasbro, the non-Wizards part, that needs to worry.
 

Ondath

Hero
Agreed. Before this whole debacle, I was still slightly sour on D&D One - the game's direction is not one I'm quite happy with since Tasha's, and I was a little hesitant with the changes they proposed in the playtest. Still, I was willing to engage with the playtest and wished WotC well with their new demographic. Then the whole OGL controversy brought me close to boycotting everything Wizards-related, and I ended up deleting my D&D Beyond account that I had for 4+ years. Now, we're back to square 1 in terms of OGL's status, and Wizards even lost more of their IP by releasing the SRD in Creative Commons.

This whole thing was such a waste of time and energy for everyone involved.
 


The lack of understanding for their own market and audience by the corporate overlords is profoundly unbelievable. Dat stock price gunna dive deeper than the Mariana trench if they're left in control.

Infomercial Fail GIF
 


DarkCrisis

Legend
The stupidest part is WotC/Hasbro got greedy and burned 20 years of good will and ended up with nothing. Less then nothing as they actually lost customers.

But don’t think they are done with some underhanded stuff. The dragon is just asleep again for now…
 
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