D&D 3E/3.5 the worst thing about 4e is the best thing about 3e...

[Weather Report]

The jermlaine appears on page 131 of the 3e Monster Manual II. It doesn't seem to have appeared in 4E though.

Along with many other Fey beings: atomie, booka, brownie, killmoulis, leprechaun, sprite, etc, etc.

 

[amerigoV]

Part of me wants to do a 4e module reclamation project. I do not have to worry about the crunch (I run Savage Worlds anyway), but see if the stories could be made interesting. Even Keep on the Shadowfell could be really good if you broke it into two stories.*


* Its problem is that it cannot decide if it is a dungeon crawl or a horror story. It tries to do both and fails miserably. Breaking that in two completely separate adventures would make an interesting total story.

The problem is every time I look at 4e adventure write-ups they all tend to have an extra-planar or underdark tie right off the bat. You cannot take a dump without falling into the Feywild or the Shadowfell. Didn't anything interesting happen on the Prime during 4e?

 

[amerigoV]

Looks pointedly at [MENTION=26651]amerigoV[/MENTION] --- What is this "lack of prep time" you allude to? Having to spend large amounts of time converting material? Difficulty running "off the cuff?"

Let me help you out with that, JeffB --- The Answer to Your Problems

I guess I have a rep - but yes, your best solution is Savage Worlds . Plus, then you can do cool mashups like my Star Wars Tour of Darkness: Endor adventure without learning any new rules (mix Stormtroopers (PCs), Endor as Vietnam, and horror -- insanity abounds!)

 

[JeffB]

Looks pointedly at [MENTION=26651]amerigoV[/MENTION] --- What is this "lack of prep time" you allude to? Having to spend large amounts of time converting material? Difficulty running "off the cuff?"

Let me help you out with that, JeffB --- The Answer to Your Problems

I had the original SW rulebook when it first came out 04 or whatever it was. Ran a couple one shots, but the game never did anything for me. But thanks for the suggestion.

 

[MerricB]

Part of me wants to do a 4e module reclamation project. I do not have to worry about the crunch (I run Savage Worlds anyway), but see if the stories could be made interesting. Even Keep on the Shadowfell could be really good if you broke it into two stories.*

Honestly, I think Keep would be improved 92.4% just by running it in Next. I think its first half is fantastic, but it bogs down in the final dungeon crawl (there are some structural problems as well). Really, the major problem I had with Keep was its pacing, which could be mostly attributed to the Horribly Long Combats of early 4e. It takes 2-3 sessions to slog through the final part of the keep; if you could run it in one session, then I think the adventure would have been much better received.

In a lot of ways, Keep really was written for a different edition. 4E adventures need a different pacing than the others.

My favourite parts about Keep on the Shadowfell involve the interaction with the villagers, and how that develops through the first half of the adventure. It made it a memorable experience.

Cheers!

 

[amerigoV]

I had the original SW rulebook when it first came out 04 or whatever it was. Ran a couple one shots, but the game never did anything for me. But thanks for the suggestion.

I can respect that. I'll say back in '04 you would not have even gotten me to try it as I was very deep in 3.x. But things change and SW has been updated and streamlined. You might give it one more shot. But you did give it a run, and that is enough IMO.

 

[amerigoV]

Honestly, I think Keep would be improved 92.4% just by running it in Next. I think its first half is fantastic, but it bogs down in the final dungeon crawl (there are some structural problems as well). Really, the major problem I had with Keep was its pacing, which could be mostly attributed to the Horribly Long Combats of early 4e. It takes 2-3 sessions to slog through the final part of the keep; if you could run it in one session, then I think the adventure would have been much better received.

Well, since this is the Internet, I will have to disagree . When I was looking at it recently for Savage Worlds (so 4e crunch really was not an issue), there were huge story problems.

If you are interested, you can read my view of it.

http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaign/lab/wikis/h1-shadowfell

 

[MerricB]

Well, since this is the Internet, I will have to disagree

http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaign/lab/wikis/h1-shadowfell

I'm getting, "Sorry, you are not authorized to view that page. (403)".

Cheers!

 

[amerigoV]

I'm getting, "Sorry, you are not authorized to view that page. (403)".

Cheers!

Had it flagged as GM only. Should be good now.

 

[MerricB]

Had it flagged as GM only. Should be good now.

It is! Thanks.

I find it fascinating how we view the adventure differently; I assign much less weight to the horror storyline, and so, what for you is a critical flaw of the adventure, is just a minor weakness for me. For my group, far more of the story was about the NPCs in Winterhaven (and Splug). We had so much fun there that when E1 started, a number of the group were living in the village. (And Splug adventured with the group through the entire series, ending as a 30th level goblin thief!)

Cheers!