There won't be a 4.5 because WotC doesn't need a 4.5

[mysticknight232]

Well stated Dungeoneer. There is no such thing as DnD 4.5e. It's a figment of peoples imagination and those people want you to get up in arms about how they perceive that game has changed. Well, the game hasn't changed at all. Sure, powers have changed and some rules have been updated, but we don't call it Magic 15.5 just because they release a new set every 3 months or reword a rule or better yet, define a term like Fear so they can take the wall of text off the card.

Just because WotC has collected all the erratta over the past 3 years and is putting it in a line of products called Essentials doesn't mean that it's a different game and suddenly labeled 4.5. No, DnD is a living breathing entity...a game, sure, but an entity that changes and evolves. Essentials is just more of that game. So until WotC sells me a book that says 4.5e on it (like they sold me a book that said 3.5 on it nearly 10 years ago), I refuse to care about the people that do nothing but complain about DnD 4.5e. Simply put, there is no such thing as 4.5e and therefore, nothing to complain about.

 

[ggroy]

It all boils down to a very simple formula here...

WotC ran out of product they could produce for 3E that most (if not all) current D&D players would buy to keep the cashflow in the company going. Thus, their answer was to revamp the core books into 3.5 and hope their players would rebuy everything (which they mostly did).

Looking at the WotC 3E D&D splatbooks released during 2002 -> early-2003, the titles become more and more "marginal" imho.


2003

- Ghostwalk (June)
- FR Unapproachable East (May)
- Fiend Folio (April)
- Arms and Equipment Guide (March)
- FR Races of Faerun (March)
- Savage Species (February)


2002

- Book of Vile Darkness (October)
- (module) FR City of Spider Queen (September)
- Monster Manual 2 (September)
- FR Silver Marches (August)
- Epic Level Handbook (July)
- Book of Challenges (June)
- FR Faiths and Pantheons (May)
- Stronghold Builder's Guide (May)
- (module) Bastion of Broken Souls (March)
- Deities and Demigods (February)
- Masters of the Wild: A Guide to Barbarians, Druids, and Rangers (February)

(ie. The well was running dry by 2002).

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Ok, after epic level handbook, wizards had no choice but kill this edition... yes it was that bad... really really bad...
I also blame the author of this book for everything that didn´t work in the initial release of 4e...

 

[ggroy]

Ok, after epic level handbook, wizards had no choice but kill this edition... yes it was that bad... really really bad...

If they took a year to work on the 3.5E versions of the core books, most likely they started sometime in mid-2002 (or earlier).

Perhaps they saw slumping sales as 2002 grinded on, possibly after the "Masters of the Wild" book.

For example, how many players would buy something like "Deities and Demigods", "Stronghold Builder's Guide", "FR Faiths and Pantheons", or "Book of Challenges" during early/mid-2002? IIRC, those titles had mostly DM stuff.

 

[Mirtek]

Obviously WotC needs a sales spike every 3-4 years to justify the continuation of D&D to the bean-counters (their own, from Hasbro or both) and it needs to be on a level that only fresh core rule sales can achieve

3e to 3.5e to 4e to 4eE the pattern is clearly visible.

The only question is whether in 3-4 years it will be called 4e Advanced, 4e Ultra, 4e Whatever or already be 5e.

 

[kmdietri]

Personally, I wish they would have called it 4.5. Then I might consider buying books again (the core books anyway). As it is now, I can survive quite easily on the compendium and character builder. I honestly have no idea where most of my characters powers feats... everything comes from.

 

[ggroy]

Further looking back into history and examining the 3E D&D release schedule, it appears WotC "front loaded" the 2001 3E D&D release schedule to the first half of 2001 or so.


2001

- Song and Silence: A Guidebook to Bards and Rogues (December)

- FR Lords of Darkness (November)

- (module) Deep Horizon (October)
- Enemies and Allies (October)
- Oriental Adventures (October)

- Manual of the Planes (September)

- FR Magic of Faerun (August)

- (module) Heart of Nightfang Spire (July)
- Tome and Blood: A Guidebook to Wizards and Sorcerers (July)

- (module) Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil (June)
- Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting (June)

- Defenders of the Faith: A Guidebook of Clerics and Paladins (May)

- (module) The Standing Stone (April)

- (module) Diablo II: To Hell & Back (March)
- Psionics Handbook (March)

- Monster Compendium: Monsters of Faerun (February)

- (module) The Speaker in Dreams (January)
- Sword and Fist: A Guidebook to Fighters and Monks (January)


It appears most of the generic player oriented splatbooks (and even modules) were "front loaded" for release in the first half of 2001 or so. In the latter part of 2001, it was more slim pickings with stuff like "FR Magic of Faerun", "Manual of the Planes", "Enemies and Allies", "FR Lords of Darkness", or "Oriental Adventures" which were either DM oriented stuff or specialized stuff for a particular setting (FR, Oriental Adventures).

It would not be surprising if they were already seeing a slight slump in sales, in the latter part of 2001.

 

[Mirtek]

It would not be surprising if they were already seeing a slight slump in sales, in the latter part of 2001.

Well they even more or less said as much.

Best-sellers are

-> Core Rules
-> First one or two rounds of splat books
-> Campaign settings (basic books)
-> adventures, campaign settings (specific region books) and niche product (like Sandstorm, Stormwrack, ..)

That's also why the tried with the new PHB each year, they simply hoped to stay close to the core rule books sales levels.

It doesn't seem that they have, otherwise I bet their would be no essentials but a continuation of the three new core books, one setting with three books and some strewn in splatbooks policy.

The later PHB2 were more like splatbooks than PHBs and seem to have sold as those instead of as PHBs

 

[Shroomy]

I agree with what Dungeoneer said. In addition, I think that WotC should eventually drop the numbered edition thing (or at the very least, de-emphasize it) and just call it D&D.

 

[ggroy]

That's also why the tried with the new PHB each year, they simply hoped to stay close to the core rule books sales levels.

It doesn't seem that they have, otherwise I bet their would be no essentials but a continuation of the three new core books, one setting with three books and some strewn in splatbooks policy.

The later PHB2 were more like splatbooks than PHBs and seem to have sold as those instead of as PHBs

I remember several nearby gaming store owners/managers mentioning that the 4E PHB3 was selling more like a splatbook than a "core" book.

For the case of the 4E PHB2, the owners/managers mentioned the 4E PHB2 sold better than the 4E PHB3, but not as good as the 4E PHB1. I suppose the 4E PHB2 had enough pent-up demand due to enough players being interested in stuff like the bard, druid, barbarian, half-orc, gnome, etc ...

I noticed at the gaming stores I frequented, the number of gaming tables dedicated to 4E games had already decreased by the time the 4E PHB2 was released in March 2009. At one store, there were originally four different 4E games going on at the store back in July 2008. By the time it was March 2009, there was only two 4E games left at the same store. (Today in 2010, there is only one of these original four games, still playing at the same store).