Third Party: If So, Then What?

[ggroy]

What I don't want is new, generic, player-specific crunch. On the other hand, I'd be all over something like Arcana Evolved, character builder or no character builder.

How much work do you believe it will take to convert Arcana Evolved to 4E?

I don't have any of the Arcana Evolved books. At the moment I can't seem to find my copy of the Arcana Unearthed Player's Handbook, but I did find my copy of "The Diamond Throne". Looking through the prestige classes, for example I'm not quite sure how some of the somnamancer's abilities will translate easily to the power structure of 4E classes.

 

[Obryn]

How much work do you believe it will take to convert Arcana Evolved to 4E?

More than I'd be willing to put into it. And it's moot anyway, because I doubt Monte would allow it to be done.

I don't have any of the Arcana Evolved books. At the moment I can't seem to find my copy of the Arcana Unearthed Player's Handbook, but I did find my copy of "The Diamond Throne". Looking through the prestige classes, for example I'm not quite sure how some of the somnamancer's abilities will translate easily to the power structure of 4E classes.

I think any attempt at a 1:1 translation for any setting from 3e to 4e is doomed to failure. The key is keeping the same flavor, while phasing out old elements and phasing in new ones.

-O

 

[ggroy]

I guess I'm puzzled, because I don't think a setting needs to be supported forever to be a success.

Case in point: Greyhawk.

 

[ggroy]

A list of 3pp settings with fairly substantial fan bases, which eventually faltered, which is a redundant distinction, since they virtually all did:

...

Everquest
World of Warcraft

As an official tabletop rpg 3pp setting, perhaps I could agree about these two settings faltering. But as a setting for MMORPG video games, I would greatly disagree.

 

[GVDammerung]

I'll echo the "adventures and campaign settings" call, not only as a consumer, but as a designer. Specifically, adventures and settings of a sort that Wizards isn't currently producing. Whether that means non-traditional fantasy, more of a "mature" focus, different cultures, different assumptions, whatever. These should have some new mechanics, but they should be heavily focused on the themes/details of the adventure or campaign setting.

I will agree with this entirely but from, maybe, a different angle. I don't play 4e. I am, however, willing to buy 4e products that I can adapt to my game of choice, just as I've purchased non-D&D material for every edition that I thought was cool and that I thought I could adapt to my D&D game. Practically, this means somewhat less crunch and somewhat more setting development. Not sure that "adapters to other editions" is a viable market by itself, but maybe tossing adapters a bone might be part of some other overarching approach.

 

[pawsplay]

What definition are you using for "faltered"? Sure, they all ended eventually, but many of them had runs long enough that they can only be called "successful." Blackmoor 3E was being published right up until 4E came out. Scarred Lands had more releases than many of TSR's own 2E campaign settings. Kalamar and Dragonlance aren't far behind.

I'm wondering what it takes for you to consider a campaign setting a "success."

I consider them all successes, and hence a warning.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey there ggroy!

I could get into something like this.

Are you planning these modules as print or pdf/print-on-demand?

There will be pdf and print versions. Eternity Publishing operates under the Mongoose' Flaming Cobra imprint 'umbrella'. So I publish the pdfs myself and they publish the print versions.

I may break the module down into three smaller chunks, each with three min-adventures just to make it available a bit sooner.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Howdy mevers!

This sounds EXACTLY like what I am looking for. I have been dying for someone to produce 3 - 5 encounter adventures.

Well I can't take all the credit for this. My inspiration basically came from Open Grave (in my opinion the best 4E book released so far) which has these tiny 2-3 encounter adventures.

Even better, in this model they come with a plot already linking them.

Okay, I can take the credit for this.

Do it well, and I will even be able to space the encounters out over 3 - 4 levels (I don't mind leveling them that far myself), effectively running a module during the course of 2 - 3 other adventures.

I was toying about with the format last night and I think having a spread of different Encounter Levels (roughly spanning 3-4 levels as you suggest) within each mini-adventure is probably the way to go.

you could even release each mine adventure on it's own, and offer a bundle version if someone wants to buy all 9.

Thats a possibility. I was thinking perhaps releasing them in groups of three, but your idea might be even more expeditious.

But please, make each of the encounters interesting, with good use of terrain and great encounter spaces.

Don't worry, it'll be good.

My problem has never been the end product, its always been the time taken getting to the end product.

 

[Baron Opal]

A list of 3pp settings with fairly substantial fan bases, which eventually faltered, which is a redundant distinction, since they virtually all did:

Midnight
Scarred Lands
Iron Kingdoms
Kingdoms of Kalamar

If I produced a 4e 3pp setting that had the longevity as one of the above, I can't see how you could possible consider it anything other than a success.

However, I think it would be difficult to produce the first three lines since they had minor to significant levels of PC class changes. Midnight in particular. Given some of the setting assumptions with Scarred Lands, I think that they could give it a respectable go. Most of their changes would be at the Paragon Path level and some feats. I'm only vaguely familiar with Kalamar, but I seem to remember that they had fairly little class changes.

The real question is how many 4e gamers utilize the DDI? Is that even a knowable or deduceable value?

Monster books, particularly themed monster books, would be a useful resource. Making custom monsters with the Monster Builder is nifty, but if you have a themed package that lets you photocopy two particular pages for an evening's fun, that would work.

 

[pawsplay]

However, I think it would be difficult to produce the first three lines since they had minor to significant levels of PC class changes. Midnight in particular. Given some of the setting assumptions with Scarred Lands, I think that they could give it a respectable go. Most of their changes would be at the Paragon Path level and some feats. I'm only vaguely familiar with Kalamar, but I seem to remember that they had fairly little class changes.

Kalamar had some timing going for it. It was a non-licensed 3PP setting before 3e came out, and then was able to come in on the ground floor, with a sweetheart D&D license, at the time of the D&D 3e launch. It was also published by the publisher of a very successful comic book and had the "Hackmaster" crowd lining up behind it even before there was a Hackmaster game. It had a nice little run, then, as far as I can tell, receded in popularity once there were other substantial offerings. Because, in the end, Kalamar amounted to a Greyhawk homage with some variants on human and humanoid cultures. But it came in a nice box, or later, an attractive hardback.

If you could get a Kalamar out in the next six months, you might have a shot.