Throw opponent into a fire... how?

[Phaedrus]

Party enters a cave where 2 ogres (or trolls or whatever) are crouched in front of a bonfire. The chosen attack strategy of one of the monsters is to grab party members and throw them into the flames (they've got a fire-obsession from their mispent youth!).

How would you handle this? Grapple? Bull rush? Is there a rule out there that I just don't remember?

 

[Magic Slim]

I think both mechanics should be mixed. A melee touch attack (provoking an AoO) in necessary to grab the opponent, while an opposed strength check would be to determine how much the grabbed character can be moved (as per Bull Rush).

Edit: the grabbing monster would need to enter the grabbed character's square, provoking an AoO from the surrounding allies of the grabbed character...

All this IMO

Slim

 

[Brekki]

You're supposed to be able to move an opponent to an area you threaten with a succesfull grapple check. That was hidden somewhere in the 3.0 Faq/errata.

So a ogre would:
- try to grab someone, provoke an AoO for that from that opponent
- win a grapple check to "hold" that opponent, moving in when winning, provoking AoO's from other opponents.
- win a grapple check to put the opponent in the fire ... possibly provoking more AoO's from opponents (3.5 only)

 

[Sanackranib]

I can't see trolls being to obsesed with pushing/tossing etc someone into fire because they cant regen frie damage. the mechanics however are detailed pretty clearly in the prior posts. then you just have to figure out what type of save to allow. I would recomend reflex and how much damage the person takes along with does there clothing etc catch on fire.

 

[Phaedrus]

The monster type was immaterial to my question, but how's this: The troll was badly burned by an opponent long ago, and still bears the scars. Ever since he is obsessed with inflicting the pain he suffered on all pesky adventurers...

OK, so grapple lets me haul/push/shove them into the fire.

What if I am sufficiently strong to pick them up and throw them? Rules for that?

 

[Legildur]

Not that it will really help you, but the Great Throw feat from Oriental Adventures does exactly what you are looking for.

 

[Norfleet]

Well, first you would grapple and pin your opponent. Then, if you had sufficient strength, you would hurl him as if he was an object. I'm sure there's a page somewhere for determining distance hurled by mass and strength of hurler.

Since giants often do such things for fun (Go for distance! Go for distance!), a scoring system has been included to help you score the quality of a throw:

Score 2 points for every meter your opponent travels before striking a surface or being. Add 15 points if initial surface contact inflicts or facilitates damage independently of hurling(spikes, fire, oil acid, etc). Score 1 point for every meter your opponent bounces after impact, measured from point of initial impact. Score 5 points for every opponent struck by the hurled opponent. Add 25 points for every opponent killed in such a manner. Add 30 points if your opponent comes to rest in a location which would inflict additional damage after bouncing. Add 50 points if your hurled opponent dies.

Example: A giant hurls a halfling 20 meters through the air (+40), striking a partymember(+5), killing him(+25). The halfling lands in a pool of oil(+15, facilitation) after striking the partymember and bounces 5 meters (+5) into a bonfire (+30), and burns to death(+50) for a total of 170 points.

Optional: Points scored may be awarded as bonus experience to the hurler.

 

[Legildur]

What about the following?

I seem to recall that a monster could grapple an opponent with a -20 modifier that enabled them to avoid the usual penalties from grappling (no Dex bonus to AC etc).

That would also mean that the troll (or whatever) wouldn't have moved into the opponent's square on a successful grapple.

Now, from the SRD:

Move: You can move half your speed (bringing all others engaged in the grapple with you) by winning an opposed grapple check. This requires a standard action, and you must beat all the other individual check results to move the grapple.

So, grab and hold (at -20 to grapple) check, and move (-20 once again I suspect) and hold them in the fire

 

[Terwox]

If you've got the 3.5 phb, check out the page on grappling, it's covered in there as to how to move opponents during a grapple.

And, bull rush can also handle this just fine, but the monsters would have to move into position. If one of them hid behind something, they might be able to rush out and surprise people. But, ogres are A) big and B) stupid, so hiding isn't that great of an option.

 

[Darklone]

Legildur had it right, it's clearly written in the 3.5 SRD. Now if you have enough trolls and ogres, forget about that part with the -20 and have each big one grapple one of your heros.