Top Twenty Print Products

Monte,

Probably because like I said, people are lazy and don't feel like writing reviews. They just feel like giving sound bites. Because that's what our society has become, sound bites. But that's a political/cultural/idealogical topic for another board and time.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Hey! "Sound Bites are Underrated!"

We have many more products that could use a review that have not been reviewed at all yet, or that have just one or two - without worrying about getting number 5 out of the way for some books.

The ENnie winners/runner ups are much more of a barometer for great products than a flawed "top 20" list. The problem is we only have those once a year! This list really has no practical use other than helping point someone with money to spend towards some good products to investigate.
 

Hmmm... not so much.

I own:
JoeGKushner said:
Position/Product Publisher Score Reviews
5. Tome of Horrors Necromancer Games 4.85 13
11. The Tomb of Abysthor Necromancer Games 4.71 7
17. Legions of Hell Green Ronin Publishing 4.58 12
18. Madness in Freeport Green Ronin Publishing 4.57 7
19. The Book of Taverns Necromancer Games 4.56 9
and I'm no slouch when it comes to d20 products.

I'm certainly very happy with what I own from that list, though.
 

Monte At Home said:
The comment about Magical Medieval Society was a good one--a product that is both print and pdf effectively splits it's reviews. It needs 10 reviews, split evenly between the two versions to qualify, or it ends up on only one list. Given that this is an internet list, and the pdf version usually comes out first, not surprisingly most of the reviews of a pdf/print product will be for the pdf version.
Then again, there are not many pdf to print products that don't change in the process, so a pdf review might not inform a consumer accurately about a print product, and vice versa.

Also notice that the top 10 pdfs have a significantly lower average rating than print products. It seems that pdfs have an inherent disadvantage, either due to reviewer bias or some property of pdfs that makes them less valued by the consumer (I think both come into play, here).
 

Well, let's see, of the top 20 products listed there, I own three (#3 Midnight, #5 the Tome of Horrors and #14 Scarred Lands Campaign Setting: Ghelspad) and have read through, at least in part, through three more (#6 the Manual of the Planes, #11 the Tomb of Abysthor and #12 the Monsternomicon Vol. 1).

I've also reviewed one of them, the Ghelspad Campaign Setting.

In light of the recent comments on a lack of reviewers, I'd like to pipe in that, since November, I've punched out my first seven reviews, and intend on churning throughout my collection of books in the months to come. So there's that.

I will mention, though, that when a book isn't fresh in my mind, finding any words for it becomes a bit harder. I'd at least like to think that, in part, reviews aren't quite so common because folk don't think to review a book soon after they finish reading it, and then when they think to, their memory, and perhaps even opinion on it, has dulled. Not necessarily likely, but it's a nice thought.

I'll also second my own distrust in reviewers; I see far too many 4's in my opinion, when I think that logic alone dictates most products should be of average quality. I find the only thing a fanboy does for me is to make me not interested in the product that they're trying to sell me on, as I put little trust in their standards being particularly discriminating.

In regards to better splitting the products and changing around the review system...

d20 is a really broad header. While I'm certain that Mutants and Masterminds and Spycraft are great products, they don't seem appropriately placed on the same list as books like Nyambe or the Book of Taverns.

On the other hand, splitting things up too much similarly creates a smaller pool of products to compare to one another. And some don't necessarily easily fit into any one category.

Just in regards to those books I've read and own, though...

Midnight: This certainly deserves to be on the list. In fact, I'd say this is possibly the best D&D book I've picked up, period. It's a rich, beautiful setting with a strong ambience to it that ties well into traditional fantasy archetypes while remaining a thing all its own. However, its magic system could really use some work. I'm not completely sure it should rank at 5's across the board, though if any book I own would, this would be it. It's place at number three doesn't seem too far off.

Tome of Horrors: This book is huge! Quantity may not be quality, but with the sheer number of beasties in here, there's bound to be something for everyone, and probably a lot of it. It's place seems about right; just because most of the monsters in it are up-dates from previous editions doesn't make it a bad thing. If it worked before, then why not now, right?

The Ghelspad hardcover: Definitely a good, solid buy. It's different enough to stand out, yet still has, in my opinion, the makings of a mainstream setting. Having been the child of the Open Gaming License, the setting is a better fit for third edition than any of the older settings retconned and retrofitted for third edition role-playing.
 

Trickstergod said:
I'll also second my own distrust in reviewers; I see far too many 4's in my opinion, when I think that logic alone dictates most products should be of average quality. I find the only thing a fanboy does for me is to make me not interested in the product that they're trying to sell me on, as I put little trust in their standards being particularly discriminating.

People mostly review the books they like, not the books they dislike. I think that has a lot to do with the higher ratings.
 

Crothian said:
People mostly review the books they like, not the books they dislike. I think that has a lot to do with the higher ratings.

Right. As a general rule, people only provide feedback on products (whether they be reviews, letters to the publisher, messageboard comments or game store talk) that they really like or really hate (and more the former than the latter). Books that are average don't inspire for good or ill.

That may be related to the decrease in the number of reviews, since in the early days of d20 products produced were strikingly different in terms of quality. They were either fairly decent or they really sucked. Nowadays, the quality level has leveled out considerably, from WotC to the smallest publisher. Not only does that inspire fewer reviews but it makes it harder to write a review. It's simply harder to tell the wheat from the chaff today. However, I suspect that the increase in the number of products since then also works against the review system. It used to be that two avid d20 fans would have a similar collection of books and could both write different reviews of the same product. Nowadays, that's not true at all. As everyone's product exposure differentiates, it's harder to get 5 reviews of the same product. As d20 fans, we seem to have organized ourselves into camps, most likely encouraged by the proliferation of campaign settings and OGL variants.

I don't think that's necessarily a good thing or a bad thing, but I do think it's accurate.
 

Monte At Home said:
As d20 fans, we seem to have organized ourselves into camps, most likely encouraged by the proliferation of campaign settings and OGL variants.

i'm not a d20 fan. ;)

i'm a D&D fanman. :D

heck, i was fifth in line at GenCon Indy this year to buy AU from some guy with cheesy facial hair and a short almost buzz cut.(except it was too curly) ;) said he wrote the book or something. :p


i think i gave a very honest opinion of the material inside.

i buy near everything. i even pester the publishers who don't stock the FLGS in my area to sell me stuff. (just ask MEG Hal :D ) (or the guy from Twin Rose (edit: Larry); he gave a friend of mine a free copy of some of his stuff) (Or Zulkir aka AV. yeah, i bought the Book of Erotic Elf pr0n :o )
 
Last edited:

Crothian said:
WEll, if someone feels that a certain product is good, review it. That's the only way that this becomes any better is to have more people review things. This is a reflection of EN World since the reviews come from the people of EN World. Some books are general, some are specific. I don't think that should matter. All people can do is review the book for what it is and not puunish it for what it isn't.

The problem is, IMO, ENWorld's reviews section doesn't provide much "frontage" for the reviews by non-staffers. I've written 4 reviews that were quite lengthy and took no small amount of time. It's annoying to see them scroll off the "10 Most Recently Added Reviews" list and basically fall into obscurity after less than a day. I kept making the mistake of posting a review right before D20 Magazine Rack would unload a 12-pack of'em :).

Seriously, if only three people read my review, is this really a good way to spend my time?

Of course, the really annoying thing is that I live in a major U.S. city--Atlanta--and still can't find many of these books, like the Monsternomicon. Can get every dang Quintessential Foo book ever published tho'.
 
Last edited:

As a reviewer I have no idea that people are reading or even listening to my reviews. I think they are, but it would be neat to have like a views number on reviews or something. But that's out of my hand. I can't make people read reviews be them mine, or anyones. I just write the reviews and hope that they help out someone.
 

Remove ads

Top