Pathfinder 1E Trailblazing Pathfinder

[Wulf Ratbane]

Also, there's the Gray Render Zombie problem, with it's 20 HD, 133 hp, and CR 6. Unturnable before level 16 in standard 3.5, and while the 9d6 turning damage (~32) of a 9th level cleric would hurt it, turning won't be any more effective than simply beating it to (re)death.

In Trailblazer, a 6th level cleric can actually turn one of those. You won't destroy it until level 40, but at least you can make it go away when it's still level-appropriate.

Yeah, I reckon you should get him about half the time.

For me, turning vs. damaging was an important thematic distinction, and that's why I came down where I did (despite having some good leads on the damage route).

I spent a long time, actually, wondering whether the inevitable HD-driven turn-immunity of non-intelligent undead was a bug or a feature. It just didn't make any sense to me that the cleric should have an easier time turning the lich than turning the lich's skeletons and zombies (Huge though they may be).

 

[joela]

Also, there's the Gray Render Zombie problem, with it's 20 HD, 133 hp, and CR 6. Unturnable before level 16 in standard 3.5, and while the 9d6 turning damage (~32) of a 9th level cleric would hurt it, turning won't be any more effective than simply beating it to (re)death.

In Trailblazer, a 6th level cleric can actually turn one of those. You won't destroy it until level 40, but at least you can make it go away when it's still level-appropriate.

I'm not seeing such a zombie under the Pathfinder Reference Document.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

I'm not seeing such a zombie under the Pathfinder Reference Document.

It's in the 3e SRD (link in original).

A 20HD zombie in PF is CR7.

 

[Fenris]

I spent a long time, actually, wondering whether the inevitable HD-driven turn-immunity of non-intelligent undead was a bug or a feature. It just didn't make any sense to me that the cleric should have an easier time turning the lich than turning the lich's skeletons and zombies (Huge though they may be).

This made me think of a nice variant. Non-intelligent undead use a turn mechanic, while intelligent undead use a damage mechanic.

 

[Bihor]

This made me think of a nice variant. Non-intelligent undead use a turn mechanic, while intelligent undead use a damage mechanic.

For flavor purpose it should be the opposit.
Zombies are too stupid to go away when they get hit by positive energy so they get damaged and lich know when to run.

 

[Fenris]

For flavor purpose it should be the opposit.
Zombies are too stupid to go away when they get hit by positive energy so they get damaged and lich know when to run.

Actually I was thinking of flavor purposes.

Non-intelligent undead are operating under pre-set orders from the necromancer who created them. The cleric presenting his holy symbol is attempting to override that control and through his divine power disrupt the control enough that the undead can no longer execute the orders they have been given and in turn flee from the source of interuption.

Intelligent undead are not under anyones command and so their orders cannot be overriden. They can choose to stand in front od that divine power and so would be damaged by it, but are not forced to flee from it. They of course could choose to flee.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Actually I was thinking of flavor purposes.

Non-intelligent undead are operating under pre-set orders from the necromancer who created them. The cleric presenting his holy symbol is attempting to override that control and through his divine power disrupt the control enough that the undead can no longer execute the orders they have been given and in turn flee from the source of interuption.

Intelligent undead are not under anyones command and so their orders cannot be overriden. They can choose to stand in front od that divine power and so would be damaged by it, but are not forced to flee from it. They of course could choose to flee.

I was with Bihor on this one, but your explanation is quite persuasive.

 

[TarionzCousin]

What about someone creating a document cataloging the differences between Pathfinder and Trailblazer?

A friend of mine--[MENTION=23396]Drowbane[/MENTION]--is planning on running a game using gestalt characters and both PF and TrB rules. Whoa.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

What about someone creating a document cataloging the differences between Pathfinder and Trailblazer?

I did something just like that when I grabbed Trailblazer. It's sitting in a spreadsheet on my computer. It was more of an analysis than a word-for-word ability comparison, though there was a lot of it. I was curious and it helped me make a judgement.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

I did something just like that when I grabbed Trailblazer. It's sitting in a spreadsheet on my computer.

Post it.