Trips?

[Mistwell]

The bonus of some weapons that allows you to drop them to avoid a counter-trip is just that, a special bonus of those weapons. Weapons that do not have this bonus cannot be droppped to avoid a counter-trip. But nothing says you cannot use those other weapons to make trip attacks still.

 

[Taren Seeker]

The bonus of some weapons that allows you to drop them to avoid a counter-trip is just that, a special bonus of those weapons. Weapons that do not have this bonus cannot be droppped to avoid a counter-trip. But nothing says you cannot use those other weapons to make trip attacks still.

Read the weapon descriptions in the PHB. All of the trip capable weapons have the same statement in them that I posted (in bold) for the Spiked Chain.

And how exactly does it happen that you cannot drop a weapon to avoid a trip? That doesn't make any sense.

 

[Asheron]

This is not supported in the item description of any axe. A dwarf may not want to use his foot, but may try to grab his opponent's leg or grab his belt and jerk him off balance. Trip attacks can be envisioned as some type of judo throw where they grab the lapel of the opponent and spin him to the ground.

If so will the Dwarf have to drop his axe to commense a trip attack? because I can't see him tripping while wielding an axe (or a shield or whatever)

 

[Caliban]

If so will the Dwarf have to drop his axe to commense a trip attack? because I can't see him tripping while wielding an axe (or a shield or whatever)

You don't normally use your arm to trip someone. You can hook your leg around their ankle or something similar. That's why it's normally unarmed, while trip weapons tend to have a hook or chain that can wrap around an opponents leg and trip them.

 

[craig copeland]

Three separate arguments, taren. moving from specific to general.

Firstly, pg 145 of Magic of Faerun lists the Staff of Mighty Sweeping, a +2 sweeping quarterstaff qhich also gives the Improved trip Feat. Therefore Staves can be used to trip people.
Staves do not say in the PHB that they can be used to trip, therefore a weapon does NOT have to say it can be used to trip someone to be allowed to do so.

The logic problem here is this. The special weapons can be used to make trip attacks. the problem occurs when you therefore claim that only they can do this. reduced to absurdity this goes something like
Oranges are Fruit.
The book does not say that apples are fruit.
Therefore apples must not be fruit.
Lastly the Knockdown Feat (sword+fist) lets you trip "whenever you deal 10pts of damage in a melee." That is VERY inclusive, isnt it.
Therefore any weapon, or melee or dragons tail can be used trip.

 

[hong]

I've always thought that you can use any (melee) weapon to trip. It breaks my sense of disbelief more to think that you can't trip someone with a staff or a spear, than to think you can trip with a battleaxe or rapier.

 

[ced1106]

I've always thought that you can use any (melee) weapon to trip. It breaks my sense of disbelief more to think that you can't trip someone with a staff or a spear, than to think you can trip with a battleaxe or rapier.

My guess is that it's easier to defend oneself when you're attacking the torso or head of an opponent, rather than attempting to trip them. Really, even with the longer reach of the staff, if the head of the staff is towards your opponent's legs, what are you defending your upper body with? If you have a shield in one hand, and attempt to protect your upper body with it while attempting to trip your opponent with a club, you're bending forwards, not a safe position in combat.

But historically, you didn't see them Romans going after their enemie's knees. And even Tolkein's Uruk-Whatevers had better things to do than go after the ankles. For play reasons, I'd rule in favor of mechanics that made tripping less beneficial than attacking in combat.

But as for a good old tavern brawl? That's something different!


Cedric.
aka. Washu! ^O^

 

[dcollins]

The logic problem here is this...

Anytime someone resorts to 4 or more lines of formal logic when arguing about D&D rules, one can usually disregard their conclusion.

- Specific weapons say they can be used for trips, and receive a special mark in Table 7-4. Weapons without that note do not have that quality. (Perhaps you'd like to argue that all weapons are also reach weapons and double-damage-versus-charge weapons, regardless of their being so noted...)

- Trip is grouped in Table 8-4 with other unarmed attack forms.
- The Sage confirmed that Trip is by default unarmed.
- The magic item and the feat you mention change the base rules, by their nature (that's the point of magic and feats).

 

[Reaver]

If I recall, isn't the example in the PHB of Tordek using his Waraxe to make the trip?? As an example of intent.

Reaver
Super Lurker

 

[craig copeland]

dcollins

That mark you're talking about in table 7.4 means "see the description for special rules" i.e there is a worded entry, not anything trip specific.

The magic item mentioned DOES allow you to modify how things work WITHIN the rules, not ignore them entirely. The magic weapon listing doesn't say "it also allows you to trip". If it did, I would be in your camp.

I would really like to see the full text of whatever skip said. saying the default is unarmed is not enough unless I know the rest of the paragraph.

It would please me if you would also respond to the Knockdown feat argument which also supports my view. If you are unwilling, I'll perhaps take that as the fact you cannot explain that away.