[True20] Is it for me?

[Scurvy_Platypus]

So, along with a ton of other people, I went ahead and picked up True20 as part of free rpg day.

Now, before you go all bonkers about how True20 is better than... well, whatever... understand where I'm coming from:

I tend to prefer rules-lighter systems. PDQ (Zorcerer of Zo) is my current gaming overlord.
I really like a number of things from C&C. No skill list and variable XP charts among them.
My first inclination is to simply strip out alot of stuff from D&D/d20 to get things down to where I want them. I want things at least as simple as the Lone Wolf OGL rpg (d20 based).

And no, C&C isn't an option for me any longer, at least at this point.

I've got Buy The Numbers to handle class building stuff, Elements of Magic to handle casting stuff, Spellweaver to handle drain-based casting, and Psychic's Handbook for my psi stuff. I've even got 4 color to Fantasy to handle really funky power creation.

How's the compatability with 3rd party stuff?

I've managed to acquire a number of different things over the past year, and would like to meld them in. In addition to some of the stuff above, I've books like the Dream Pod 9 Mecha Compendium Deluxe that I'd like to be able to tap into and use.

I don't mind doing a bunch of back-end work setting up individual classes, slotting rules together and so forth, in order to bring myself some sweet customized low complexity gaming at the end.

How would True20 handle me doing customized XP charts? I can do it easily in D&D/d20 using Buy The Numbers, but how far off the "baseline" is True20?

Is moving to a "skill penumbra" like C&C has going to break the system?

Given the above, is True20 even really worth it for me? Or should I just stick with homebrewing D&D like I'm inclined to?

 

[Wrathamon]

So, along with a ton of other people, I went ahead and picked up True20 as part of free rpg day.

that was a deal!!

Now, before you go all bonkers about how True20 is better than... well, whatever... understand where I'm coming from:

i will try to answer your questions but some of the more experienced TRUE20 people might be better able to answer some of them.

I tend to prefer rules-lighter systems. PDQ (Zorcerer of Zo) is my current gaming overlord.
I really like a number of things from C&C. No skill list and variable XP charts among them.
My first inclination is to simply strip out alot of stuff from D&D/d20 to get things down to where I want them. I want things at least as simple as the Lone Wolf OGL rpg (d20 based).

TRUE20 does have skill list but it is streamlined and trimmed down.
I am not sure what damage porting the C&C skill system over would do besides upsetting class balance.

I've got Buy The Numbers to handle class building stuff, Elements of Magic to handle casting stuff, Spellweaver to handle drain-based casting, and Psychic's Handbook for my psi stuff. I've even got 4 color to Fantasy to handle really funky power creation.

How's the compatability with 3rd party stuff?

Very compatible and you may like their magic system as well if you dont want to add other mechanics into the mix. It seems like adding all that other stuff may be bloating things.

The class system is very streamlined. And, someone on their forums already did a Point Buy system for it. If you dont want to just use the Three Classes they provide.

I've managed to acquire a number of different things over the past year, and would like to meld them in. In addition to some of the stuff above, I've books like the Dream Pod 9 Mecha Compendium Deluxe that I'd like to be able to tap into and use.

TRUE 20 is a universal genre system. They acutally have Mecha rules.

I don't mind doing a bunch of back-end work setting up individual classes, slotting rules together and so forth, in order to bring myself some sweet customized low complexity gaming at the end.

The only thing complex about TRUE20 is keeping track of the damage track. Everything else is very easy to deal with. There are some nice player aids some of the fans made up for the damage track.

How would True20 handle me doing customized XP charts? I can do it easily in D&D/d20 using Buy The Numbers, but how far off the "baseline" is True20?

They dont use XP charts. You level up however the DM/GM wants. They recommend at story arc breaks.

Given the above, is True20 even really worth it for me? Or should I just stick with homebrewing D&D like I'm inclined to?

Well it was free! So, if anything you may get some good ideas on how to streamline D20 into a non complex system.

 

[EditorBFG]

Regarding the True20 Mecha rules, they are part of the Mecha vs. Kaiju setting, which I edited for BFG, and some flaws crept into the numbers. If you want to use them, you need to get the errata-- available free at this link: http://enworld.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=7649&

I want to make sure the word gets out, because anyone who put the published mecha against the published kaiju would have some difficulties, to say the least.

 

[Aus_Snow]

How's the compatability with 3rd party stuff?

Anywhere from easy to moderate, generally.

How would True20 handle me doing customized XP charts? I can do it easily in D&D/d20 using Buy The Numbers, but how far off the "baseline" is True20?

You could add in any kind of XP system, just about. As for the baseline, it's still more or less d20. But I'd have to dig out BtN again, to be sure here.

Is moving to a "skill penumbra" like C&C has going to break the system?

It would take a bit of mucking around, but that doesn't appear to be an issue, so I don't see why it would (break the system).

Given the above, is True20 even really worth it for me? Or should I just stick with homebrewing D&D like I'm inclined to?

Hm. If you enjoy homebrewing systems, why not stick with the thing you love doing? And if you are competent at doing that, according to your own criteria, what you make is likely to be more precisely suited to your needs.

I've done both (homebrew d20 [past] and True20 [present]) and they're both fun. So I can't, or maybe won't, really recommend one over the other.

Sorry, that's not very definite, I know. :\


One last thing - I've found the True20 Companion very useful for mixing up that system more to my liking. I also house rule it a bit anyway, as is my habit. Just a thought.

 

[GlassJaw]

I can't get into True 20. It over-simplifies some things and over-complicates others. I really don't like the damage save system. It doesn't emulate enough styles for my tastes. I also find the magic to be unnecessarily cumbersome.

If you want something with less rules, definitely check out Grim Tales. The magic system is easy to use and very flexible.

 

[Turanil]

I much like True20, and for customization and creation of new classes, there is the (excellent) True20 Companion.

Now as for reading your post, I am not sure about what you ask. IMO:

-- Conversion is relatively easy when it comes to converting feats (or class abilities into feats) to True20. Converting monsters is a little more difficult (because of HD vs the True20 dmg/toughness system). Convertin magic or psi is nigh impossible since the two systems are so different.

-- Making custom classes and adding new stuff is very easy using the True20 Companion. However, using your Buy The Numbers, Elements of Magic, Spellweaver, Psychic's Handbook and 4 color to Fantasy, with True20 seems to me to be unfeasible. Reading that part of your post I think True20 isn't appropriate for what you want...

-- XP charts: generic classes, and those created using the True20 Companion are supposed to be balanced with each others. As such, a single XP chart for all classes is the way to go. Note that True20 doesn't handle XP, instead stating that leveling is left at the GM's discretion (PCs level when the GM says so, no XP are recorded).

-- For a rule-lite system, I suggest using the "alternate damage system" houserule found on the True20 forums. The regular dmg system is the part I don't like about True20, but this houserule fixes it very well for me.

 

[jdrakeh]

I also find the magic to be unnecessarily cumbersome.

That was the big deal breaker for me. First, magic is effects-based, which in and of itself makes it granier that a list-based spell casting system. The real problem, though, is that the effects of many powers in True20 (e.g., fire shaping) must be calculated during actual play based on the stated desired effect. This makes the True20 powers system more flexible, yes, though that flexibility comes at the cost of significantly more complication during actual play, as the final effect of many powers is entirely dependent upon variables that are subject to change from one application of those powers to the next.

 

[EditorBFG]

However, using your Buy The Numbers, Elements of Magic, Spellweaver, Psychic's Handbook and 4 color to Fantasy, with True20 seems to me to be unfeasible. Reading that part of your post I think True20 isn't appropriate for what you want...

I thought true20's magic was based on the system Steve Kenson developed for the psychic's handbook to a certain extent?

In any case, I think if True Sorcery can be subbed into True20, Elements of Magic could also be, with little trouble. Just replace the Adept with the Mage and ignore True20's magic system. As for Buy the Numbers, I think True20 Companion's own class creation system would remove the need for it.

I will say that if someone is this into tinkering, what they might want to do is take the parts they like from True20 and add them to what they're doing already. There is certainly a lot to like.

 

[jonrog1]

That was the big deal breaker for me. First, magic is effects-based, which in and of itself makes it granier that a list-based spell casting system. The real problem, though, is that the effects of many powers in True20 (e.g., fire shaping) must be calculated during actual play based on the stated desired effect. This makes the True20 powers system more flexible, yes, though that flexibility comes at the cost of significantly more complication during actual play, as the final effect of many powers is entirely dependent upon variables that are subject to change from one application of those powers to the next.

True, but I find having the PC's figure out some signature effects moves this along pretty quickly. They also take ownership of their powers, rather tan choosing from a list. YMMV.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

I used the BCCS magic system (True Sorcery is what it became). That's very time-intensive, but I found the player with the magic user took the time onto himself and crafted effects before the game, for the most part. Sometimes he'd have to whip up something on the fly, but he'd take a time action anyway.

The real PITA for me was having to craft effects for the evil spellcaster types. I went through and made a spellbook that I kept on hand.

--fje