Trying to work around a DM's restriction

[the Jester]

I'm not following your argument here. In 3.x, DMs had to limit the amount of content in their game if they wanted any semblance of balance. In 4e, I have seen absolutely no problem with allowing every every source available.

However, there is a problem in expecting the dm to read every source available to check for balance.

 

[Nytmare]

Huh. I had been operating under the assumption for a while now that Dragon and Dungeon didn't have the same quality control that the books had, and that, in general, you shouldn't trust anything that wasn't included in one of the annuals.

I thought that this is how we ended up with things like the Coure Attendant and the other "epic tier" familiars.

 

[chitzk0i]

However, there is a problem in expecting the dm to read every source available to check for balance.

Just ask to review what the players actually pick. That's a drastically smaller set of options. Besides that, 4e is balanced enough. There are a few outliers, but the vast majority of material for 4e can be let in without worry.

 

[eamon]

Huh. I had been operating under the assumption for a while now that Dragon and Dungeon didn't have the same quality control that the books had, and that, in general, you shouldn't trust anything that wasn't included in one of the annuals.

I thought that this is how we ended up with things like the Coure Attendant and the other "epic tier" familiars.

That's heroic tier, isn't it? And what's wrong with it?

 

[TheUltramark]

Not only does my table not allow magazine stuff, we don't allow things from a book that we as a group don't own two of. That said, if someone finds a power or spell or whatever, and want to use just that one thing, it's usually not a problem. The thing is, though, often times it gets to 'that guys' turn, and he pulls a "wait, where is that mag???" and the action grinds to a halt.

 

[LevinSerra]

Huh. I had been operating under the assumption for a while now that Dragon and Dungeon didn't have the same quality control that the books had, and that, in general, you shouldn't trust anything that wasn't included in one of the annuals.

That is our DM's stated reason. He has gotten enamored of the Dragon Magazine's assassin/VHM combo, so we might be able to talk him around. I do worry about cascading consequences from that, cause most everyone has seen something or other that they want from the magazine...

I did have one clarification question: if I get, say, a frost weapon and am playing around with Coiled Serpent, 2 of it's class features add on chunks of poison damage to your other attacks, for instance, spending an action point to attack means anything I hit takes 10 ongoing poison. Is that damage type changed by my frost weapon as well?

Thanks for all y'all's responses.

 

[Nullzone]

I don't believe so. A frost weapon causes all damage dealt by the weapon to be frost; ongoing 10 isn't damage dealt, it's an effect.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I'm not following your argument here. In 3.x, DMs had to limit the amount of content in their game if they wanted any semblance of balance. In 4e, I have seen absolutely no problem with allowing every every source available.

And that's why we're all different. IMO, there's too much stuff for me to take care of as a DM; while the human brain (hard drive) has unlimited capacity, the working memory (RAM) has serious limits. It's more convenient to limit products.

 

[chitzk0i]

And that's why we're all different. IMO, there's too much stuff for me to take care of as a DM; while the human brain (hard drive) has unlimited capacity, the working memory (RAM) has serious limits. It's more convenient to limit products.

So instead of worrying about the content that the players actually bring to the table, you want to screen every piece of content they could possibly bring to the table? Wouldn't it be a whole lot simpler to have a discussion with your players about what power level everyone is comfortable with?

 

[Arlough]

Not only does my table not allow magazine stuff, we don't allow things from a book that we as a group don't own two of.

We use the same rule, but with the exception that if you own the book yourself, you can use the power even if you are the only one at the table who owns the book. We started this to encourage people to start financially supporting the parts of 4th ed they liked.

That said, if someone finds a power or spell or whatever, and want to use just that one thing, it's usually not a problem. The thing is, though, often times it gets to 'that guys' turn, and he pulls a "wait, where is that mag???" and the action grinds to a halt.

And this is the reason we have instituted a combat timer. If it takes you more than 2 minutes to decide your course of action, you lose your turn. This actually didn't start with custom or Dragon powers, but with the chaos sorcerer in PHB2. You could play one if you wanted to play one, but you had to keep track of your crap.

As for banning Dragon, I am perfectly okay with that. I would say that Dragon magazine is responsible for about 50% of the power creep we have experienced, and about 75% of the feat overflow.

If a DM wants to use it, fine. But I am not about to deride him for not wanting to even deal with it. As it is, there are only 2 things that I will currently allow from Dragon Magazine, the Whip feats from 368 and Staff Fighting, also from 368.