Undead and Turning

[dlibutti]

Need some help please.

I am new to the whole 3rd edition rules. I ran into an undead turning issue on my first game I DM'ed.

I had a level 3 cleric roll a 15 on tunring undead (4 ghouls were attacking them). With the help of the other party members we decided the 4 ghouls were turned. One PC argued that they should be destroyed. The rules were very confusing as to what exaclty should have happend. I am sorry I don't have the PH or DM guide in front of me at this time. Can anyone tell me what should have happened and why?

Thanks,

Newbie DM

 

[CRGreathouse]

Need some help please.

I am new to the whole 3rd edition rules. I ran into an undead turning issue on my first game I DM'ed.

I had a level 3 cleric roll a 15 on tunring undead (4 ghouls were attacking them). With the help of the other party members we decided the 4 ghouls were turned. One PC argued that they should be destroyed. The rules were very confusing as to what exaclty should have happend. I am sorry I don't have the PH or DM guide in front of me at this time. Can anyone tell me what should have happened and why?

A ghoul has 2 HD; a cleric must have 4 levels to destroy such a creature. The turning check is different from the turning damage.

Here's the steps:

* Roll a turning check. For a level 3 cleric, you must roll (1d20+Cha modifier) at least a 7 to turn a ghoul.
* Roll turning damage. You can turn up to 2d6+cleric level+Cha modifer total HD; in the case of a Cha 11, third-level cleric, 2d6+3 HD.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Undead are only destroyed if the cleric's level is twice their individual hit dice (or higher).

Ghould have 2 hit dice, and half the cleric's level is 1 (drop fractions), so they aren't destroyed. If he were level 4, he'd be right.

Do you understand "Turning Damage"? There are now two rolls to turn undead...

-Hyp.

 

[Crothian]

Well, after the 15 on the turn undead chart (which gives us cleric level +1, or a 4) you needed to roll2d6+3 (cleric level) +cha modifier to see how many total HD are turned.

The way they would have been destroyed is if the cleric was 4th level, twice the level of the HD of the ghouls.

 

[Epametheus]

Hmmm...

If he did the turning damage necessary to turn the 4 ghouls, then they were turned, not destroyed.

A character making a turning attempt has to have an effective level of at least double the enemy's effective HD to obliterate it/seize control of it. So the L3 cleric would not have destroyed the 2 hit die ghouls.

This brings up my own couple questions, which'll hopefully get answered: 1) Does turn resistance factor into the actual turning damage (so does a L5 vampire require 9 points of turning damage to drive off?), and 2) does it factor into destruction/compulsion of the undead (does it take a L10 cleric to blow away that vampire, or a L18 cleric to do it)?

 

[dlibutti]

Thanks for the explanation. I missed out rolling to see how many HD he could turn. I'll remeber it for next time.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Re: Hmmm...

This brings up my own couple questions, which'll hopefully get answered: 1) Does turn resistance factor into the actual turning damage (so does a L5 vampire require 9 points of turning damage to drive off?), and 2) does it factor into destruction/compulsion of the undead (does it take a L10 cleric to blow away that vampire, or a L18 cleric to do it)?

It's treated as having hit dice equal to HD + TR for all turning effects.

-Hyp.

 

[Crothian]

Re: Re: Hmmm...

It's treated as having hit dice equal to HD + TR for all turning effects.

-Hyp.

Listen to this man, for he knows what he is talking about. Just another way of saying I agree, I concur, he's right. Leting you know that more then one person agrees with this statement. It's all good.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Re: Re: Re: Hmmm...

Listen to this man, for he knows what he is talking about.

Even when it comes to Elven Bootmaking?

-Hyp.

 

[Crothian]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Hmmm...

Even when it comes to Elven Bootmaking?

-Hyp.

Sure, for all I know you've been making boots out of elves for years. So, as long as you seem to know what you're talking about (like in the above thread) he should listen to you.