OK, "Monster Only Power" was bad naming. What I mean is Things Only Enemies Can Use Just Because They Can. See below for elaborations.
Wraithdrit said:
Drowcrafted weapons and armor are by far NOT Monster Only Powers. Monster Only Powers would be a special ability or something the players can't use.
So you can wield that drow sword for a short while, until you return to the surface. The drow, on the other hand, can use it all the time. So unless this is a campaign that completely takes place in the Underdark, you don't get as much out of this item as the drow does. And not before this particular item is intelligent and only accepts evil drow wielders (something that should be rather rare) but because it doesn't work upstairs - where you are most of the time.
Drowcrafted weaponry can be used. But once taken out of the underdark it will probably crumble. So you can hangon to it for ten years if you don't plan on going to the surface. Its yours, use it. Just know that it has a limited life. Its like giving NPCs wands with limited charges that they can use, and the PCs get the wand with like 10 charges left. Is that robbing the PCs? Nope. Neither is this.
But the NPC gets the same out of the staff as you - 10 charges. He doesn't have an advantage on that.
And now you're limited on walking in the Night Below or you lose it. Your average sword can be taken to the surface, to the deepest Underdark, to the plane of your choice, to your mother's birthday (although she might object to your coming armed - but the weapon won't turn to dust).
drnuncheon said:
No, I'm saying that a party who fights nothing but NPCs will wind up with too much magic, because NPCs have 3x normal treasure. They will have (through application of simple math) 3x normal treasure.
Do you want to tell me that they get as much treasure as a monster of their CR, and than the same amount again, and then once again?
I didn't really challenge your point that they get too much. My problem lies with them being to weak even as they have three times (thrice, 3x) the normal allotment ot stuff. It further lies with the practice to give *some* of these NPC's *even more* treasure, but not giving that treasure to the players. Instead of giving them, and only them, pseudo-treasure, why don't we empower *all* NPC's in a way that doesn't make the players cheated or restricted. You could give them a better array of ability scores, or an extra level for the same CR.
Big garbage? You didn't really think that through before posting it, did you?
Let's look at a 'monster only power' to see why. How about a beholder's eyebeams?
By your argument, it's unfair that the party who defeats a beholder is not able to take and use its eyebeams, because because to do it any other way would make it a 'monster only power' and therefore 'big garbage'.
As I said, that name was chosen badly. What I mean is stuff players can't use just because.
I don't have a problem with monsters that have special powers on a genetical level, but this is not the case with drow weapon that doesn't work in the Night Above.
Some examples of the Issue I was talking about:
A friend of mine played in a (2e) campaign where they fought gnolls (or something else, doesn't really matter). These gnolls had the ability to parry attacks - players would roll really good, even potential crits, but the DM just told them "he parried". The players, on the other hand, didn't have the possibility to parry - not with an item, not with a non-weapon proficiency, they just couldn't do it. It wasn't a mystical power, it was just a damn parry, something players just couldn't do.
In a 2e campaign I played in myself, one NPC was a drow Thief/Mage/Fighter - but the XP wasn't divided equally. This isn't normally possible, but that NPC managed to do it "with magic". Of course, players couldn't use such magic.
In another 2e campaign, we ventured into some caves, which extended far into the underground and quickly became a giant maze of tunnels and caverns that probably covered the whole underground below the continent. We didn't venture far - we just had to obtain an Item from a small city of dark elves, or "drow", which lived down there and almost never came to the surface, except for some quick raids by night. As we encountered some of these drow elves, we found out that they had really nifty weapons of excellent workmanship and powerful enchantment - the likes we haven't seen up there in the open. We managed to kill some of these elves and obtain some of these arms and armours, and considered them well- and hard-earned, for these drow didn't sell themselves cheaply, with their superior equipment. We got the item we were after and returned to the mountain range the caves were located in - and found out, to our greatest dismay, that our new powerful magic items crumbled to dust, the DM telling us "it's drow stuff, you can't use it up here". We may have had less objections if we wanted to stay longer down there, but we had to get back to the surface (the campaign was set up that way), and so couldn't use the weapons that cost us so dearly.
arnwyn said:
Nah, I don't believe in such ridiculous conspiracy theories about "veterans" who "want drow weapons back because they love restrictions".
It isn't a conspiracy theory. I didn't claim that the Illuminati forced Wizards to give them back drowcraft.
But I do know a lot of AD&D players that refuse to play 3e just because you can play Dwarven Paladins or Elven Evokers. They actually like 2e because there are a lot of things which aren't allowed.
And it has happened that changes were made even though only a minority wanted these changes.
