D&D 5E Unearthed Arcana: Giants survey is up

[doctorbadwolf]

They started playing with an idea of a Psion using the Concentration mechanic that I thought was at least more interesting, bit I doubt it will go anywhere at this point.

Yeah there are a lot of ways to go that aren’t as overwhelming as the mystic or as….basic, as the psi warrior fighter.

 

[Parmandur]

Yeah there are a lot of ways to go that aren’t as overwhelming as the mystic or as….basic, as the psi warrior fighter.

Well, I think the Psi Warrior gets the basic meat and potatoes "I hut things, but sometimes I also use the Force" motif. But they could do something more off the wall, and Concentration manipulation felt both on theme and mechanically distinct

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Well, I think the Psi Warrior gets the basic meat and potatoes "I hut things, but sometimes I also use the Force" motif. But they could do something more off the wall, and Concentration manipulation felt both on theme and mechanically distinct

The psi warrior would be great if it weren’t the only “I stab and throw things with my mind” subclass.

Concentration is fertile ground, for sure.

What I’d also love to see is things like a strong push, pull, blasts, bursts, and stuff throwing, all as attacks you can use, thus making the not-a-Jedi option tactically versatile in a similar way to battlemasters but in a more telekinetic way.

 

[Parmandur]

The psi warrior would be great if it weren’t the only “I stab and throw things with my mind” subclass.

Concentration is fertile ground, for sure.

What I’d also love to see is things like a strong push, pull, blasts, bursts, and stuff throwing, all as attacks you can use, thus making the not-a-Jedi option tactically versatile in a similar way to battlemasters but in a more telekinetic way.

The model they were playing with was having an effect, like Telekinesis, being held through Concentration, with spell Slots being fed into the Effect to enhance it and do extra tricks.

 

[Kurotowa]

The psi warrior would be great if it weren’t the only “I stab and throw things with my mind” subclass.

Much as I enjoy 5e, this is definitely part of its inherent limitations. The full caster classes have a great deal of power and versatility, but it's all in their Spellcasting feature so they have a very limited budget for getting their subclass packages to be distinctive or transformative. The non-caster classes have a lot of room for subclasses to be distinctive, but without the versatility of spells they're limited to "distinctive ways to hit people". The half-casters have the most transformative subclass options because they have the least investment in the base class package, but the base class has the least distinctive identity and they can struggle with power as their spell levels fall behind.

It's a vicious tug of war where no one is entirely happy, and it would take some significant redesign to fix it.

 

[Maxperson]

The model they were playing with was having an effect, like Telekinesis, being held through Concentration, with spell Slots being fed into the Effect to enhance it and do extra tricks.

I'm playing a Psi Warrior on a Play by Post game here on EN. He's 9th level and for my feats I took Telekinetic so that I can do more force pushing, Telepathic because Psionic(duh!), and Gift of the Gem Dragon which lets me do damage and possibly a telekinetic push as a reaction when I am hit by a creature within 10 feet. For one of my magic items I took Psionic Reach from Fizban's which lets me use the full on Telekinesis spell once per day.

All of that makes it really feel like a psionic warrior.

 

[Parmandur]

I'm playing a Psi Warrior on a Play by Post game here on EN. He's 9th level and for my feats I took Telekinetic so that I can do more force pushing, Telepathic because Psionic(duh!), and Gift of the Gem Dragon which lets me do damage and possibly a telekinetic push as a reaction when I am hit by a creature within 10 feet. For one of my magic items I took Psionic Reach from Fizban's which lets me use the full on Telekinesis spell once per day.

All of that makes it really feel like a psionic warrior.

Yeah, all in.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

The model they were playing with was having an effect, like Telekinesis, being held through Concentration, with spell Slots being fed into the Effect to enhance it and do extra tricks.

Yeah I wish they’d do that for the BM Ranger tbh. Let me spend a spell slot to just make my wolf into a mega-spirit-wolf of vengeance for a minute, or grow large and grow wings, or whatever.

Then, instead of “land, water, air” as the whole distinction, make it a sub distinction like the Moods for Summon Fey, and make the main distinction more like “pack Hunter”, and “ambush predator”, and “herd charger”.

Much as I enjoy 5e, this is definitely part of its inherent limitations.

Yeah. I’m hoping that more e petite ration with feats will open things up a little, but they are also more free with pb/lr abilities and also with “burn spell slot for not-spell” stuff.

The full caster classes have a great deal of power and versatility, but it's all in their Spellcasting feature so they have a very limited budget for getting their subclass packages to be distinctive or transformative.

Yeah I think the wizard especially suffers from this, but the Druid is close behind. Tbh I wish they’d limit the casting of the bard more and expand on bardic inspiration more.

The non-caster classes have a lot of room for subclasses to be distinctive, but without the versatility of spells they're limited to "distinctive ways to hit people".

I think we have seen some very good exceptions to this, both magical and non-magical. Mostly in the rogue and monk, IMO.

The half-casters have the most transformative subclass options because they have the least investment in the base class package, but the base class has the least distinctive identity and they can struggle with power as their spell levels fall behind.

This I strongly disagree with. The half-casters have a lot of base class flavor. The Paladin so much so that thier subclasses struggle to create significant mechanical distinction until later levels.

It's a vicious tug of war where no one is entirely happy, and it would take some significant redesign to fix it.

I think you could hew pretty close to stock 5e and fix it, but it would require new versions of the classes, and replacement optional features as a baseline concept.

 

[Kurotowa]

This I strongly disagree with. The half-casters have a lot of base class flavor. The Paladin so much so that thier subclasses struggle to create significant mechanical distinction until later levels.

Sorry, I should have been more clear with my terminology. I was thinking of Warlocks and Artificers, not Paladins and Rangers.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Sorry, I should have been more clear with my terminology. I was thinking of Warlocks and Artificers, not Paladins and Rangers.

Huh. I still disagree, but I can at least see why you might see it that way.