Useless sorcerers no one wants in the party

[Plane Sailing]

My first ever sorcerer character is a wonderful illustration of the difference between creating a multiclass character as a high level replacement as against bringing them up the long way.

It had occurred to me that a paladin/sorcerer might have nice synergy. Got up to paladin 2 (for fearlessness) and then started as sorcerer. pal2/sor1 was fun, pal2/sor2 was a drag (one extra cantrip, woo!), pal2/sor3 was OK getting a 2nd level spell (but the party wizard was casting fireballs and I'd fallen far behind the party fighters I once stood alongside).

By the time he had reached pal2/sor4 he was a singularly unfun character to play in the party - being neither fish nor fowl. Sorcerers turned out to be one of the worst classes for multiclassing (apart from a 1 level dip which works fine).

You live and learn, eh?

 

[diaglo]

Sorcerers turned out to be one of the worst classes for multiclassing (apart from a 1 level dip which works fine).

You live and learn, eh?

2 lvl dip for fighters
1 lvl dip for the 2000ed ranger or barbarian...

etc...

multiclassing is for the guy who likes to F with the system...

 

[Mystery Man]

The sorcerer in my group has done well with his feat choices regarding his offensive spells. He can change the nature of his fireball to cold and so on. He can also shape them. However when it comes to utility spells he is largely lacking so when they have to accomplish a task that absolutely needs a utility spell they have to spend money to get scrolls etc. Any foe with a teleport spell at this point is unbeatable. Which reminds me, I need to have a chat with him...

 

[iwatt]

I completely disagree, each caharacter needs to be usefull.

Why?

Personally, I like to play competent characters, but I'd never limit myself and my friends to playing extremely efficient tactical strike teams able to bring down a Great Red Wyrm in 1.5 rounds. That's one way to play (and very fun if everybody is on the same page) but can also be anoying if this isn't the style the other want to play.

And finally, in one of the games I'm playing, the DM is terribly anoyed with my superpowerful spellcaster. Every single combat my wizard is the prime factor in beating the encounter. Guess what he is: a gnome illusionist with spell focus conjuration. His illusions are mostly used outside of combat (scouting, tricking, stealing) except for Displacement. Damage dealing spells are fun, but aren't essential (I have none). Of course my DM could screw me over by sending stuff immune to my spells, but the fact is he could always do that, for whatever spell selection I had.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Personally, I like to play competent characters, but I'd never limit myself and my friends to playing extremely efficient tactical strike teams able to bring down a Great Red Wyrm in 1.5 rounds.

There's a difference between "useful" and "tactical strike team useful." Not every character need to be so efficient that they belong on a tactical strike team. But if a character isn't useful at all, the other PCs start to wonder why they're traveling with this guy.

For some groups, being useful outside of combat is enough. For me, it's not. D&D adventuring is a deadly profession, particularly in combat (of which there's often a lot, even in an RP-heavy game.) If a guy can't help out when things get dangerous, and instead hangs back and let's me risk being killed/level-drained/turned into a wight by myself, I start looking for a new companion. Regardless of how much of a discount he gets from merchants in town.

 

[DarkMaster]

Truthfully, I couldn't consider playing a sorcerer that didn't have that spell.

On a related note, when I ran the Sunless Citadel, I made the

Spoiler

gnome fighter/cleric prisoner

into a half-elven sorcerer. I chose spells that the rest of the party thought were stupid (or at least, not very useful) (sleep and burning hands - I didn't want to take Magic Missile) and the party never stopped dissing my sorcerer, and made no attempts to save him when he fell unconscious and died.

AR

Sleep useless in the Sunless Citadel???? IMC the sorcerer downed countless enemies with that spell. Much more than with MM.

 

[Evilhalfling]

My Favoriate sorcerer ever used mount as his primary spell. I dont even remember anything else he would cast, besides invisiblity and fly. He only lasted about 4 games, as you can only go so far with a 7 int /7 wis. If your personality is big enough, no one examines your magic.

The only combat monster I have ever played is in the current game, where even at 11th lvl
it is a cutthroat dungeon, with 1 death per session.

 

[Three_Haligonians]

There's a difference between "useful" and "tactical strike team useful." Not every character need to be so efficient that they belong on a tactical strike team. But if a character isn't useful at all, the other PCs start to wonder why they're traveling with this guy.

For some groups, being useful outside of combat is enough. For me, it's not. D&D adventuring is a deadly profession, particularly in combat (of which there's often a lot, even in an RP-heavy game.) If a guy can't help out when things get dangerous, and instead hangs back and let's me risk being killed/level-drained/turned into a wight by myself, I start looking for a new companion. Regardless of how much of a discount he gets from merchants in town.

Heh! You would hate my sorceror, but my group seems to appreciate her excessive ranks in bluff and diplomacy when we have to sell off treasure. She has all of two or three damage dealing spells (17th level sorceror), but back in the beginning she had none. That didn't mean I just sat back during combat and let everyone else do their thing. I just found ways of making the spells I had effective. Ghost Sound came up over and over, for instance. With intelligent enemies, I'd bluff about having backup, and have the sounds of them approaching, and with unintelligent enemies I'd just have the Ghost Sound make other monster noises. Bigger monster noises. Now that I'm higher level Mass Suggestion keeps cropping up in combat. It's not whether or not the sorceror's spell list is useless, but whether or not the player is useless.

R from Three Haligonians

 

[Pants]

Heh! You would hate my sorceror, but my group seems to appreciate her excessive ranks in bluff and diplomacy when we have to sell off treasure. She has all of two or three damage dealing spells (17th level sorceror), but back in the beginning she had none. That didn't mean I just sat back during combat and let everyone else do their thing. I just found ways of making the spells I had effective. Ghost Sound came up over and over, for instance. With intelligent enemies, I'd bluff about having backup, and have the sounds of them approaching, and with unintelligent enemies I'd just have the Ghost Sound make other monster noises. Bigger monster noises. Now that I'm higher level Mass Suggestion keeps cropping up in combat. It's not whether or not the sorceror's spell list is useless, but whether or not the player is useless.

R from Three Haligonians

Well, considering that, it sounds likt you were useful in the game, so I don't see what the problem is.

Maybe I didn't read it right, but it seems to me that Lord Pendragon wasn't equating 'being useful' with 'having direct damage boom-boom' spells. If you can find a way to make the most innocuous, least offensive spell useful in a combat scenario, then by golly it sounds like you're useful.
What Pendragon and others are talking about (I think) are the sorcerers who would take spells like Unseen Servant and Nystul's Magic Aura at 1st level and not find a way to use them.

 

[Doug McCrae]

My next character concept that I'm really looking forward to playing is designed to be totally useless in combat, but very useful outside of it. He's going to be an Expert, with only Knowledge skills.

Sounds more like an NPC.