D&D 3E/3.5 Using 3.0 Spell Durations with 3.5 Spells

[Olaf the Stout]

After talking about this with a couple of players in my group (I'm the GM) I am thinking about changing the spell durations for the 3.5 spells back to 3.0 durations for buff spells. This would include spells like Bull's Strength, Cat's Grace, etc., as well as spells like Fly, Invisibility, Blur, Haste, etc.,

Has anyone done this in their game? Were there any problems with this?

Olaf the Stout

 

[Li Shenron]

I think the main reason why the 3.0 duration were changed was because they were "not much fun", so if you don't think they are less fun than the short ones, you won't have any problems going back. In any case they aren't less fun than those magic items which give you the bonus all the time.

Some said that they were too powerful with that duration, but I don't think so... in fact they didn't simply reduce the duration but they also fixed the bonus at +4, which is better than the older 3.0 version (a slighlt but important difference IMO). You can choose whether to reinstate that as well.

Personally I still play in 3.0 so I'm not the one you need to ask if they work, of course they do

Eventually, it's possible that some 3.5 material like spells or feats is designed by comparison with the new buff spells, specifically with the short duration in mind, so you need to keep an eye on anything that gives an ability bonus.

 

[Li Shenron]

BTW, Haste is completely different, are you reinstating only the duration? It used to be the 1/round anyway...

 

[Olaf the Stout]

BTW, Haste is completely different, are you reinstating only the duration? It used to be the 1/round anyway...

Yes it is the durations only that I am reinstating. Everthing else in regards to the spells will still be as per the 3.5 PHB. So for Haste there will be no change. It was 1 round/level before and it is 1 round/level now.

Invisibility on the other hand is 10 mins/level in V3.0 but only 1 min/level in V3.5. I'm not sure whether there are any other buff spells whose durations change like this though apart from the 6 stat boost spells which went from 1 hr/level to 1 min/level.

Olaf the Stout

 

[el-remmen]

I changed/kept durations on a bunch of spells, including the buff spells.

All the buff spells in my game last 10 minutes / level. In addition, mass buff spells require all those to be affected to lock hands - making it nearly impossible to cast mid-combat.

As does invisibility.

Other changes include:

Fly: If this spell’s duration ends while the subject is aloft, he plummets to the ground.

Haste: This spell forces the target to make a Fortitude save (DC 13) at the end of the spell’s duration or be fatigued.

Magic Fang, Greater: The duration of this spell is 10 minutes per level.

Magic Weapon, Greater: The duration of this spell is 10 minutes per level.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I changed/kept durations on a bunch of spells, including the buff spells.

All the buff spells in my game last 10 minutes / level. In addition, mass buff spells require all those to be affected to lock hands - making it nearly impossible to cast mid-combat.

As does invisibility.

Other changes include:

Fly: If this spell’s duration ends while the subject is aloft, he plummets to the ground.

Haste: This spell forces the target to make a Fortitude save (DC 13) at the end of the spell’s duration or be fatigued.

Magic Fang, Greater: The duration of this spell is 10 minutes per level.

Magic Weapon, Greater: The duration of this spell is 10 minutes per level.

And did it affect your game much?

Olaf the Stout

 

[el-remmen]

Well, in the sense that it kept the flavor we like. . . yes.

The changes worked for us, but that might be largely due to the type of game I run and my players like.

For example, it made no sense to use that invisibility was suddenly 10 times less useful for things like scouting and spying because it did not last long enough.

In terms of flying, none of us really like the "coddling" of spellcasters and like the idea of there being a dangerous aspect to magic and the occasional bad consequence (thus the haste change).

 

[Olaf the Stout]

Well, in the sense that it kept the flavor we like. . . yes.

The changes worked for us, but that might be largely due to the type of game I run and my players like.

For example, it made no sense to use that invisibility was suddenly 10 times less useful for things like scouting and spying because it did not last long enough.

In terms of flying, none of us really like the "coddling" of spellcasters and like the idea of there being a dangerous aspect to magic and the occasional bad consequence (thus the haste change).

Yeah, one of the reasons that we were thinking about changing some of the durations was that one of the players brought up the fact that Invisibility is no longer useful for scouting/spying and really only good for combat. This seems to go against the original intent of the spell to us which is why we wanted to change it back.

One of the players seems to think that WotC are just trying to turn D&D back towards its wargaming roots and away from the "roleplaying" side of things. I'm not sure that I agree with him but he does seem to have a point in regards to the Invisibility duration change. Almost all spells now seem to concentrate solely on combat rather than other utility type things. Either that or I forgot to take my medication again!

Olaf the Stout

 

[The Human Target]

I do the same thing.

I just prefer casters to not have to either recast things too many times per day (especially with the vancian magic system) and I like not having to have the PCs (and NPCs/Monsters for that matter) eat up as many beginning rounds of combat. It just always seemed silly to me for people to burst into a room, roll iniative, and then stand around casting spells and glaring at the badguys for twelve seconds.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I went through and had a look at the buff type spells up to about 5th level. Out of them the 5 stat buff spells, Invisibility, Levitate, Fly and Greater Invisibility are the only spells that changed duration. Out of them, the only one that I have a question mark on changing back to the 3.0 duration is Greater Invisibility.

Olaf the Stout