Using an assassins death-attack fairly

[Arnwyn]

Has anyone actually used the assassins death-attack as a DM or had it used against them as a player? How did it go?

Yes, as a DM I've used it one time.

It went fine - the player botched his Spot and Listen checks, but made the save. The assassin was killed in short order.

 

[frankthedm]

My first thought seeing the thread title:

"Why on earth would an assassin fight fair?"

Damn skippy! If you don't want dead PCs, don't use assasins. Considering they are minimum 7th level charcters, that means they know what they are doing. Forget about AC and HP, the first thing that makes an assasin a danger is Gather Information. The first PC to die to an assasin is going to be the guy CDGed in his sleep, then the next sleeper gets CDGed, all the whle the assasin watches the person on watch. Only once all possible CDG targets are dead should an assasin bother to try to use his death attack.

When that fails, and the one on watch tries to wake the others, he realizes they are all dead.

I had a player say to me just yesterday while we were driving looking for minis/action figures & hanging out

He says "Frank, we have been playing in your game for a while, how come we never see any competent rogues?"

Me, smirking "If they are competent, then you won't see them until they have CDGed someone."

 

[genshou]

A good house rule, if you want to introduce it, is to change all death attacks and effects to 'Save or be reduced to -1d10 hp'. People rarely die in 6 seconds from a knife wound anyways. It still dramatic, as the struck character is immeadeately felled, but your friends now have a fighting chance to save you.

I like this. It's similar to the d20 Modern MDT mechanic (which I am a fan of). Thanks for the tip, wuyanei!

 

[genshou]

The foreshadowing idea is nice, but when using it I'd be paranoid that the players would poke holes in my telling of it. E.g. "You only gave us one listen check, why didnt we get one when he opened the door as well as when he broke the window?". I'll see how well it fits when the moment comes.

They get one Listen check to hear the assassin's movement in and unto itself, unless there is a reason why a new check would be needed (such as changing speed or walking across broken pottery). For everything else that makes a noise (such as a door opening/closing, a broken window, a crossbow/handbow/gun being used), they get a Listen check against the sound's DC.

 

[LostSoul]

Let me just say that when a DM uses some kind of technique to bag your PCs and doesn't follow the rules, it can be a real pain.

So DMs: When you're using assassins, make sure that you get everything right. Plan every DC before you go to the table. Once there, if you're not sure about something, err on the side of the PCs.

 

[Luthien Greyspear]

Has anyone actually used the assassins death-attack as a DM or had it used against them as a player? How did it go?

I have. Party was lured into an underground crypt by Zhentarim agents (really just a small cavern complex under a really big tree) and then the entrance was set on fire, trapping them. They dug their way out next to a primary root of a tree some 30 yards away, and one character jumped (ring of jumping) to the tree branch to tie the rope. He ties it off, yanks it to signal all clear, then dropped dead next to the hole with an arrow in his back.

The Zhentarim assassin had made his Listen check just a little late to stop him from tying the rope, but managed to shoot him out of the tree (magic bow with a big enhancement that allows death attacks within sneak attack range).

Fortunately (literally) the party had just scrounged a raise dead scroll from the crypt, and had it handy. The assassin got away, and the party knows he's out there.

My recommendation? Make the availability of revivification magic seemingly random, and make it far enough in advance that they don't realize right away that you were planning this. A good idea would be to have a high-ranking priest owe them ONE favor for their services, so that they have to blow it on the assassin's victim.

 

[LostSoul]

Has anyone actually used the assassins death-attack as a DM or had it used against them as a player? How did it go?

I used it once. The PC made the save.

The assassin was invisible.

 

[KRT]

That's not entirely true in pratice. I've had a PC 1 1/2 levels above the rest of the party for like 5 levels now.

This may be cheese DMing--thats why you don't tell the player your motivations. If having a party with a big level-spread is messing up the game, you've got to do something about it. That's just one way to do it.

I do lots of stuff like this. My players trust me to run a fun game. That's why they've been coming back every Thursday night for two years.

So if I cheat on my wife, but don't tell her I'm not a piece of sh*t? Come on it's still cheese when you are using it to rebalance the party. Instead make it easier on yourself and nuke the offending well played character from orbit (you know, just to be sure) cause he might just make the save against the Assassin [please inject a liberal amount of sarcasm in what I have said thusfar]. Anyway even though you run a fun game and your player's verify that you are a good GM the incentive now is to not hold back. Now the lead guy may as well be suicidal bonzai because all cheese is pointed in his direction. So instead of a balance the result is fairly chaotic.

I would also propose that an assassin that is hired to take out a party would not take out the toughest first as he stands the highest chance of failure and then has the whole party to face. He would pick off the weaker ones first, or those that have the greatest vulnerabilities. If the toughest guy likes to go off on his own a lot then yes that's the time to target him, but otherwise its take out the best odds first and reduce the number who can aid the tough guy. Even if contract was specifically against the tough guy he would still try to take out the helpers. So an assassin well played would wipe out the whole party and the level difference in party would remain.