D&D 5E Using Class Features for Magic Items?

[Trit One-Ear]

Hey all,
My party's wizard has ended up with a mark connecting him to the Elemental Plane of Water due to a magical experiment. I'm hoping to treat it as a magic item, and have been looking at what kind of bonuses make sense.
With the new caster items in Tasha's I feel like using one of those as an template makes sense, but I also want to dip into Sorcerer abilities since that thematically makes sense (part of his magic now comes from within, not from his studies.)I'm curious if my current idea feels balanced to y'all. I've taken the Curse of the Sea ability from the Sea Sorcerer (UA) and added a +1 bonus to DC's and attack rolls.
Here is my current idea:

Water Mark Tattoo
While this mark is on your skin, you gain a bonus to spell attack rolls and to the saving throw DCs of your wizard spells (for this item the bonus is +1).
When you hit a creature with a cantrip’s attack or when a creature fails a saving throw against your cantrip, you can curse the target until the end of your next turn or until you curse a different creature with this feature.
Once per turn when you cast a spell, you can trigger the curse if that spell deals cold or lightning damage to the cursed target or forces it to move. Doing so subjects the target to the appropriate additional effect below, and then the curse ends if the spell isn’t a cantrip (you choose the effect to use if more than one effect applies):
Cold Damage. If the affected target takes cold damage from your spell, the target’s speed is also reduced by 15 feet until the end of your next turn. If the spell already reduces the target’s speed, use whichever reduction is greater. This effect does not work with spells that have their damage type changed through Order of Scribe abilities.
Forced Movement. If the target is moved by your spell, increase the distance it is moved by 15 feet.

Any thoughts? If this feels like a good magic item, what rarity would y'all think it is? Currently leaning towards rare but I'll be honest I'm not sure on things like this.

Best,
Trit

 

[Bayushi_seikuro]

Personally, I think it's a cool idea. The only things I would think would be by adding sorcerer abilities, are you taking away from another PC? Like if you have another sorcerer in the party, I wouldn't steal their cool ability.

Secondly, I don't know that it really requires thinking about rarity if the ability isn't able to be duplicated. To steal from Marvel, it would only be required to worry about 'rarity' on Captain America's abilities if they were able to be duplicated as they are. There are plenty of knock-off versions of Cap out there, for sure, but it's not a process that can be duplicated in the same way that, for example, Wolverine's can.
YMMV

 

[Weiley31]

I mean, I see nothing wrong having a magic item grant a Class Feature ability from another class or subclass. It's similar in idea in which you can give a NPC or monsters class abilities. Like a boss Monk enemy having Action Surge and Second Wind.

Now just like how not every monster is gonna have class abilities, but bosses or elites have class abilities, so too should like not a common magic item grant Class Features/Abilities. You wanna reserve that for like higher tier magic item like a +3 or like a legendary item. Artifacts would probably not need to do that because of how they already have their own quirks to begin with.

But perhaps a PC, thats been around for a long time in the party and hasn't died or has seen enough BBEGs, a Weapon or Magic Item that grants a Class Feature from another class or a different subclass could be their Iconic weapon.

The only issue is that, supposedly, some people may "complain" about something like that stepping on the toes of the class that your jacking features from that a player is playing. I think that's stupid. If a pc is worried about their toes being stepped on, either make sure everybody gets a similar item, its a rare legendary item, or just tell em that if they don't stop, they go back in your basement and won't come out for a month like last time.

 

[Tonguez]

Theres a couple of magic items that already mimic Feats, so thats probably a route I'd consider using. Metamagic feats etc would be appropriately built in to a Watermark

 

[Trit One-Ear]

Thanks all,

You're right @Bayushi_seikuro - I don't think I need to worry about rarity. I've been trying to use DMG guidelines for magic item loot, but I'll just tack this on there.
And yes, I definitely don't want to step on any toes giving away cool class abilities they're already using. Our Sorcerer isn't a Sea origin, so I'm not too worried about giving the wizard something that feels unique to her.
@Tonguez I hadn't thought about metamagic options... I know he's already thinking about taking that feat at the next chance. Maybe that's a good way to handle this...

I think I need think a little more and decide if a Class Feature or Feat is the best way to do this.

 

[Bayushi_seikuro]

Thanks all,

You're right @Bayushi_seikuro - I don't think I need to worry about rarity. I've been trying to use DMG guidelines for magic item loot, but I'll just tack this on there.
And yes, I definitely don't want to step on any toes giving away cool class abilities they're already using. Our Sorcerer isn't a Sea origin, so I'm not too worried about giving the wizard something that feels unique to her.
@Tonguez I hadn't thought about metamagic options... I know he's already thinking about taking that feat at the next chance. Maybe that's a good way to handle this...

I think I need think a little more and decide if a Class Feature or Feat is the best way to do this.

I think when it's an 'item' like a Boon, I don't know that rarity is an issue. The only thing maybe to think about is how would it be affected by things like anti-magic or dispelling. Again, like a lot of questions, it's hard to know because those things are so related to table-specific situations.

And Weiley, the reason I mention being careful about stepping on other characters' toes is because as of late, I've been buried in the great rpg horror stories on reddit, of which a lot involve the DMPC or the DM's significant other being able to do anything the other players can... but better. That's the funny thing about things 'going without saying'; sometimes they need to be said so people know its been thought of

 

[Weiley31]

I still think a NPC Wizard with Meta Magic would be a nice way to pretend to be a form of forgotten Elven High Magic.

I would say see what kind of classes the pcs are. And then from there, plan out stuff like that what your asking about for those that are in a class and the party. So if your pcs only have one Warlock in the party and no other warlocks, you can have it where their patron was so pleased with them doing a task for them, that the Warlock gets a gift from the Patron that allows them to have TWO Patron Pact Boons. So a Tome Warlock, if they are the only warlock in the party, could earn a Patron gift that lets them use the Pact of The Blade Boon as well. Or a Chain Pact warlock gain an gift like that instead.

Have only one Cleric in the party? Perhaps they find a sacred relic that allows them to use the Smite Class Feature from the Paladin. Etc, etc.

 

[Quartz]

Any thoughts?

It should affect water magic only, and there should be a disadvantage, like Vulnerability to fire damage.

 

[tetrasodium]

Hey all,
My party's wizard has ended up with a mark connecting him to the Elemental Plane of Water due to a magical experiment. I'm hoping to treat it as a magic item, and have been looking at what kind of bonuses make sense.
With the new caster items in Tasha's I feel like using one of those as an template makes sense, but I also want to dip into Sorcerer abilities since that thematically makes sense (part of his magic now comes from within, not from his studies.)I'm curious if my current idea feels balanced to y'all. I've taken the Curse of the Sea ability from the Sea Sorcerer (UA) and added a +1 bonus to DC's and attack rolls.
Here is my current idea:

Any thoughts? If this feels like a good magic item, what rarity would y'all think it is? Currently leaning towards rare but I'll be honest I'm not sure on things like this.

Best,
Trit

Water Mark Tattoo
While this mark is on your skin, you gain a bonus to spell attack rolls and to the saving throw DCs of your wizard spells (for this item the bonus is +1).
When you hit a creature with a cantrip’s attack or when a creature fails a saving throw against your cantrip, you can curse the target until the end of your next turn or until you curse a different creature with this feature.
Once per turn when you cast a spell, you can trigger the curse if that spell deals cold or lightning damage to the cursed target or forces it to move. Doing so subjects the target to the appropriate additional effect below, and then the curse ends if the spell isn’t a cantrip (you choose the effect to use if more than one effect applies):
Cold Damage. If the affected target takes cold damage from your spell, the target’s speed is also reduced by 15 feet until the end of your next turn. If the spell already reduces the target’s speed, use whichever reduction is greater. This effect does not work with spells that have their damage type changed through Order of Scribe abilities.
Forced Movement. If the target is moved by your spell, increase the distance it is moved by 15 feet.

It looks like a fun item that will be enjoyed at the table buuut is likely to make your sorcerer realize that the christmas morning "OH WOW!" was misplaced because he has the following spells that work with it

• 2 cantrips
• 3 1st level spells, absorb elements shows up on dndbeyond sorcerer spells wirt cold damage but only because it can absorb & then add cold damage to a melee attack & chromatic orb because you can choose cold damage
• 2 2nd level spells, one of which is only there because dragonbreath includes it among the many damage types you can choose it to deal
• 1 4th 5th 6th & 7th level spell with the 7th level spell being prismatic spray that can deal cold damage on 1 of 8 rays

Also... I could be wrong, but I don't think any of those spells include a movement component but if not just linked to cold damage spells that forced movement bit almost forces the character to take 2 levels in warlock for agonizing repelling blast. Combined with the lack of spells that actually work with the item's cold component that resulting frustration has a good chance of pushing the player to give the whole cool cold sorcerer concept the finger and just take the warlock levels.

Back in 3.5 there were a lot more viable paths that did not include burning hands scorching ray fireball & the other 5e spells with too many dice to their level including cold ones so you might want to skim through that & ether steal a bunch to give to the sorcerer as "these are on your list now" or take a bunch of 5e spells & declare the tattoo allows casting them as cold. Keep in mind though that wotc made your efforts difficult here by making a bunch of spells "intentionally overtuned" & pretty much left it with the helpful advice of "embrace the imbalance" so either you will need to pick spells with an effect putting them 1-2 levels higher in the dmg283/284 chart for raw damage or with secondary effects making up the gap so even if you put together a cool thematic list not doing that it could be so sub par that the player feels hamstrung even with the benefits of the tattoo.

 

[Trit One-Ear]

Hey all,

Just updating to let you know I've decided to give the Wizard the (modified) Sea Sorcerer option as I listed above. He's welcome to still take Metamagic as a feat, but I'd rather give him something more directly tied to water atm.

@tetrasodium - you brought up a really good point I hadn't considered: the number of spells this actually effects. Your list was super helpful, although the character in question is a Wizard, not a Sorcerer. Luckily, this opens things up a good bit more for him:

• 2 Cantrips
• 5 1st level spells (some of which do various elemental types, including chaos bolt which is random)
• 2 2nd level spells (including one type of dragon's breath)
• 2 situational 3rd level spells

and a handful more beyond that level, including classics like Cone of Cold.

This feels a bit better, and as a Wizard I can make a point of giving him a chance to add cold spells to his spell book.

Thanks everyone - really appreciate the insight on this!


Trit