Pathfinder 1E Using OGL stuff that isn't online

[cgraph]

Here's a question for those who buy products and write them alike. If you have a product that may make use of material that is in the OGL but not yet on the SRD. It's the Riven MAge from Super Genius Games (and if you don't have it, buy it).

Now there are two choices. 1. Reference it and if you can get permission from the company, add a purchase link. 2. add the mateial, stripped of any non-OGL content into your product. The first may leave people without the product unable to use your product, while the second often leads to a larger product that is more expensive.

This is obviously a YMMV style question, but I was wondering what people think in general.

 

[Ahnehnois]

Even if it isn't in the PRD, it's very likely in the PFSRD. And if it isn't, you might want to tell them that and they'll probably add it.

 

[Wicht]

It is my rule of thumb, if the monster is not in the Core books (defined by myself as being The Core Rulebook and the first bestiary), I add the entire stat-block for any creature in question. You don't, generally, want to force people to buy another book in order to use your book. The inclusion into the PFSRD is irrelevant to me in this matter.

The use of the material should always be noted in section 15 of your OGL form, and I think it is in general good taste to give credit where due outside of the book, if not inside.

 

[Kinak]

I would follow Paizo's lead on this. Whenever they use a monster from outside their core materials, they provide the entire block and include references for where to find the original.

Cheers!
Kinak

 

[Wicht]

I would follow Paizo's lead on this. Whenever they use a monster from outside their core materials, they provide the entire block and include references for where to find the original.

Cheers!
Kinak

Though Paizo includes all of the bestiaries as core material; I've debated with myself of late whether or not to do the same. I feel most comfortable I think, assuming the first is core and the rest are supplements. I would be interested to know what other Pathfinder players think of this.

In general, though I recognize it takes up space, as a DM, I personally prefer to have all the stat blocks in the text.

One solution possible, and its something promoted by Steve Russell, publisher of Rite Publishing is to not include any core creatures, but strive to have every creature be unique, either through the addition of a template, class, or just making a new monster. That's not always possible, but it does add value to the stat blocks when they are unique unto themselves.

 

[cgraph]

Well, this is for the Riven Mage system. I've created a few new archtypes for it, but equally, obviously you need the entire system to use it. But my problme, is that, even if it's legal to use the OGL bits, I'm not so certain it's moral, in the sense that it might undercut the sales of hte original product.

OTH, I suppose I could always email SGG and find out if they do intent to ever put it on the PFSRD and just hold fire until they do. (for those interested in it, it's a very nice, and very light magic system).

 

[knottyprof]

If you are working on an item to publish the easiest way would be to just reference the original document and make sure it is clearly stated both within the document and on the sales page that the Riven Mage System is required for some (or all if that is what the product is) material within. As long as it is clearly documented so the consumer knows that your product isn't a stand alone then you should be okay. If anything it may prompt them to pick up the other product you are referencing. Are the archetypes the only thing your product will contain or will you have other stuff that doesn't need the Riven Mage system?

 

[Wicht]

But my problme, is that, even if it's legal to use the OGL bits, I'm not so certain it's moral, in the sense that it might undercut the sales of hte original product.

Not only is it moral, it is often highly appreciated by the original authors to see their work being used or referenced. That's the whole point of the OGL. Just make sure that you do your section 15 properly in the OGL and you are good. The real problem is in perceived value among some consumers; and the verdict is out on this as its highly subjective. Some, like myself, like to see the whole stat block, others think the ink could be put to better use. Now, if it is a matter of a rule's change, or subsystem, if it is an adventure what I would do (and have done) is put a summary of the new rules, enough to get by for the adventure, but not the whole other book, in a side-bar. Alternatively, if you are picking up a whole new way of doing things, for, say, a campaign guide, you'll want the whole set of rules but it would be very good form to give a shout out in the text to the original authors (or alternatively, give them co-credit design kudos in the book). But there is nothing unethical about using anything that is OGL. The more cross-pollination there is, the better off everyone is. At least that's my opinion on the matter (though its an opinion I know is shared by some few others).

 

[Owen K.C. Stephens]

I happen to be in an unusually place with my opinion on this, as the author and copyright holder, so keep in mind this is my humble opinion and other folks might have a different take for other products.

First, I am a HUGE fan of the OGL. Without it there wouldn't be any Pathfinder, much less SGG products in support of Pathfinder. So we try to make sure we make a clear OGL designation in each product so people know it's safe to use our game rules in their OGL products. Riven mage has one, and it's pretty much our standard:
"DECLARATION OF OPEN CONTENT: All game mechanics, proper names of classes, prestige classes, archetypes, feats, skills, spells, magic items, monsters, rituals, artifacts AND/OR the names of abilities presented within this book are open game content as described in Section 1(d) of the License."

So you can use any of the rules from the book in your own OGL product without worrying about it, and you don't need to rename things. We specifically open up the names of things, so if you want to do archetypes for the riven mage, you can reference "Riven Mage" so people can know what it's for.

Now the OGL itself throws some restrictions on trademarks and product identity, so you technically aren't able to safely use the actual name Super Genius Games. We don't want other people putting out things using the Super Genius name for obvious reasons. That said if you want to reference "The Genius Guide to the Riven Mage" in your product, I am *fine* with that.

As for morale or ethical concerns, I wouldn't like seeing all the rules of a book of ours copied whole cloth as a new product... but I have NO problem with a core mechanic being duplicated so it can be built on. So if you need to talk about how rivenspells work so you can introduce new rivenspells of rivenspell archetypes, that's totally reasonable.

And if you end up with specific questions, we are very open to having people contact us.

 

[Zireael]

This is a very good point.

Hey, do we have a base of OGL-related questions and tidbits?