D&D 3E/3.5 v4: Challenge Ratings pdf (3.5 compatible)

[Upper_Krust]

Hey U_K

Hiya mate! :

Hmm... I seem to remember something being in one of the Forgotten Realms books... I'll have to check it out later (I'm at my friend's place right now).

Okay.

Edit: Hmm... I had another thought today. About spellcasting.. I was thinking about making it that a player can select individual spells that he'd be able to cast (spells known, spells readied, spell slots, spell level. All of these would need to be ranked, with those first three split into the 9 spell levels somehow). I told one of my players about it, and he was enthusiastic about it.

You could always just choose a level of integrated spells.

This idea was mainly derived from some manga I'm reading at the moment (Naruto), where there are these ninja that use techniques/spells using their chakra (spiritual energy). This works with the ninja knowing a certain ability.. and I thought it would be a nice idea to have the character learn them individually in a similar way as that.

I don't see why not.

The only ploblem I see with that is characters being able to learn higher level spells (in theory). I know I could limit it, but, like with what I said some days ago, I'm not sure if it would really matter (they'd trade it off in exchange for other abilities). If I don't want a player to learn a certain ability yet, they just won't be able to find anyone to teach them..I guess. What do you think about this?
/edit

You could always just allow them to take a spell-like ability for a single feat equivalent - they could then use this ability 3/day. The caster level would be equal to their virtual class level and the

Ok, I'll go through it on sunday (if I get the chance) and check out the abilities one at a time.

No problem.

Alright, I'm patient Really appreciate it

Okay, hunting this scrap of paper down could take me longer than I thought.

Hmm.. I hope everything is going okay with the server o.o

If you are refering to my past computer illness it wasn't the server that was the problem - luckily I got it sorted though. Thanks for thr inquiry though.

Well, I explained it to one of them (the other is out kickboxing right now), and he seems to think well of it

Minimum two votes to one - I say go for it!

There was some hassle with the Wealth for XP thing, just like I expected (mainly because I feel the same), but I think I was able to explain why it was necesarry.

I would just let wealth freeform and not worry about it.

Edit: *is back home again* Ok, the other one shares ciaran00's opinion on XP (as I expected). But, I think(/hope) I got the point across well enough. Same hassle with the Wealth for XP thing (only allot more than with the other player). He likes the system though, so that's good.

We made a little quick test character with the stuff I already had. I'm now not really sure that ability score increases are correct at 0.1 CR, since the player rather put his points in his Str than in BAB (he boosted his Str from 15 to 20 in two levels, and only took one point of BAB), but, other than the ability scores, it looked great (for as far as we went).

I would keep them at 0.1 until he reaches his racial maximums (23 for humans) and then then start taking them as +0.2 (as per the epic feats)

Now I'll only need to have...
-The list of individual spell CR, and all that comes with it.
-A list of class abilities that players can pick on the fly (I think I'll make the list first, and check which ones I'm not sure about after that).
-The races for the base, and possible abilities branching from that (like that rage stuff I emailed you about some time ago).
After I'm done with those last three things, I think I'll be able to go try it out for real.

Have fun!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

This might be better served in seasongs thread, what do you think?

I came up with this (admittedly light-hearted) monster for a different thread and wanted to know what you thought of it. Your CR system put it at about 24000, but I think that's too high -- what do you think?

(Sorry about the lack of formatting; there's no convenient way to transfer this from Word.)

Tarrasque Swarm
*SNIP*

Well you have made a number of fundamental mistakes with regards the Swarm concept.

A swarm deals 1d6 damage for every 5 HD it posesses; so it should be dealing an automatic 7200d6/round.

Also you seem to have forgotten its Ability Score increases - +1/4 HD; so it should have at least 1500 in every ability score - incidently if you were using my parameters (and therefore staying true to Monster Manual progression of ability scores) it would have a minimum 6000 in every ability score.

Looking at my other Design Parameters I would change things like Natural Armour; Regeneration and Spell Resistance.

 

[Upper_Krust]

UK,

Hiya mate!

This may have already been asked and answered, but why aren't Frightful Presence and Keen Senses part of the Dragon Traits? Don't all dragons have both of these abilities?

Dragons only gain Frightful Presence at a certain age.

Darkvision and Low-light Vision are already included within the Dragon Traits.

 

[Upper_Krust]

UK,

Hello again mate!

The CR you have for a Mature Adult Copper Dragon (before silver rule) is 35 (rounded off, and I'm using this number for the sake of simplicity)...

CR 35
+35 levels of wealth (7) = 42

Now, you suggest that because the total CR increased, you should apply wealth again, right? So, I should apply wealth to the additional 7 levels?

+7 levels of wealth (1.4) = 43.4

However, the CR has increased yet again, so yet another application of wealth is necessary to round it off...

+1.4 levels of wealth (0.28) = 43.68

Now, application of the silver rule brings it down to a 40.

Is that how wealth (equipment) should work when calculating ECL? Just want to make sure I've got it right. The higher CRs were throwing me off. Also, did I apply the silver rule correctly?

Lets see...

CR 35 + 7 (wealth: 35th) = 42
CR 35 + 8 (wealth: 40th) = 43 (after Silver Rule = 40)

Therefore the ECL will be 40.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

Also, one more question.

Fire away.

It's about Substituting Core Rules and CR. Most of your CRs convert over to two-thirds, but do you still recommend converting dragons over by one-half?

Just curious.

If you update Dragon Spell Resistance using the Design Parameters (SR = HD +12) then I would say the 2/3rds is valid.

Otherwise use 1/2.

 

[kreynolds]

Dragons only gain Frightful Presence at a certain age.

Good point.

Darkvision and Low-light Vision are already included within the Dragon Traits.

But those two do not make up the entirety of keen senses. Dragons can also see twice as far as humans in normal lighting conditions as well. Do you not find this aspect of keen sense consequential enough to rate?

 

[kreynolds]

Lets see...

CR 35 + 7 (wealth: 35th) = 42
CR 35 + 8 (wealth: 40th) = 43 (after Silver Rule = 40)

Therefore the ECL will be 40.

i.e., yes.

 

[kreynolds]

If you update Dragon Spell Resistance using the Design Parameters (SR = HD +12) then I would say the 2/3rds is valid.

Otherwise use 1/2.

Sweet. Thanks!

 

[CRGreathouse]

Well you have made a number of fundamental mistakes with regards the Swarm concept.

A swarm deals 1d6 damage for every 5 HD it posesses; so it should be dealing an automatic 7200d6/round.

That looks like a good general guideline. Is there any reason to think it's (HD/5)d6, round up, rather than (say) (HD/6+1)d6, round down?

Also you seem to have forgotten its Ability Score increases - +1/4 HD; so it should have at least 1500 in every ability score - incidently if you were using my parameters (and therefore staying true to Monster Manual progression of ability scores) it would have a minimum 6000 in every ability score.

Nah. Monsters get racial modifiers, which subsume +1/4 modifiers. Heck, the rat swarm (for example) has the same stats as individual rats, not increased as its 4 HD would indicate if this were the case.

Looking at my other Design Parameters I would change things like Natural Armour; Regeneration and Spell Resistance.

Swams have natural armor as their invividual parts and no more. Not even the 12HD hellwasp swarm gets NA...

I'm more than willing to change regeneration and SR, though, as those were basically arbitrary -- crude extrapolations from the number of creatures in the swarm and comparitive increases in other swarms.

 

[Kavon]

Hiya mate!

Hey again U_K

Okay.

Let's see...
Magical Training [General] (from the FR campaign setting book)
Prerequisite: Int 10
This gives you two 0th level arcane spells, once per day each, which use the character's arcane caster level (minimum 1) as caster level. This can only be taken at 1st level as well.

Does this seem worth 0.2 CR to you?

You could always just choose a level of integrated spells.

Hmm.. Yeah, I guess. I think me and my players prefer it if spells were individually taken, though.

You could always just allow them to take a spell-like ability for a single feat equivalent - they could then use this ability 3/day. The caster level would be equal to their virtual class level and the

Hmm.. That last part seems unfinished
But anyway.. Yeah, I think I could do something like that..
Hmm... How much would 0th level spells be costing like this?
Caster level x Spell level x 0.003 for 3/day.. let's say at 1st level, that would be.. 1 x 0.5 x 0.003 = 0.0015?
A 1st level spell, at 1st level caster level would cost 0.003 CR, or 3 XP?? Isn't that a very low cost?
I think I'll let them increase the caster level individually from character level. Like, if they want to learn a 5th level spell (9th caster level minimum) once per day, that would be 0.045 CR or 45 XP. If they want to increase the times per day by one, the total would become 0.09 CR, or 90 XP. So, they'd need to put another 45 XP in the spell to increase it like that. If they now want to increase the caster level to 10, the total changes to 0.1 CR, or 100 XP, so they'd need to put an extra 10 XP into it.
I'm not sure, but I think some of these results seem pretty low costing (like the increasing caster level to 10 costing only 10 XP).
Now that I'm looking at this.. Shouldn't there be a difference in cost between Always Active and the other ones below it? Having something permanently active seems allot more powerful then only being able to do it 5 (or even 10) times per day. Same goes for At will (though it should be slightly less than always active I guess).

Okay, hunting this scrap of paper down could take me longer than I thought.

*uses the Force to try and help U_K find the scrap of paper*

If you are refering to my past computer illness it wasn't the server that was the problem - luckily I got it sorted though. Thanks for thr inquiry though.

Oh, no, I was refering to EN world not working too great at the time. I think I remember reading about you having some problems with your computer though. Glad everything is working again now

Minimum two votes to one - I say go for it!

I would just let wealth freeform and not worry about it.

Hmm... But if I let it all out the window on the wealth, wouldn't there be an inbalance after a while? I know at least one of my players likes to go to a town and find the rich neighbourhood to pillage through.. so, the player would end up with loads of wealth to spend (and he will), which would make him allot stronger than his XP total would allow for.
Or did I misunderstand you?

I would keep them at 0.1 until he reaches his racial maximums (23 for humans) and then then start taking them as +0.2 (as per the epic feats)

Ah, ok. Sounds good.
Where/how do I find these maximums?

Have fun!

Thanks