Vampire Template - Relatively Finished

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Clay_More mate!

Should that be 127 hit points?

 

[Clay_More]

Nope....

Latest edition of the Vampire rules. Vampires add their Charisma Modifier to their Hit Dice, as normal characters adds their Constituion modifier. I know, it gives em alot more hitpoints, but after all, theyre paying for it.
One thing that is cumbersome to calculate into the Vampire's CR is the Unnatural Weakness (dunno if you read it). This weakness makes them unable of basically using magical items. So, adding the wealth measurement to a Vampire is pretty useless, since there's little money can buy that they can use.

Ill be looking at the leader of the bad ones a little bit later, just wanted primarily to test the Template. CR 56.6.... thats alot.... does all the weaknesses count for much in that estimate?

I like the site you referred me to, alot of stuff & hints there...
My own, honest opinion on the Gifts. I think Acid, Sonic & Cold gifts might go against the "feel" of the Vampires. Lightning might be suitable in the way I imagine them now, but otherwise...

 

[Upper_Krust]

Nope....

Latest edition of the Vampire rules. Vampires add their Charisma Modifier to their Hit Dice, as normal characters adds their Constituion modifier.

Where the heck are these rules from?

It seems anethema to what Undeath stands for.

I know, it gives em alot more hitpoints, but after all, theyre paying for it.

How are they paying for it?

One thing that is cumbersome to calculate into the Vampire's CR is the Unnatural Weakness (dunno if you read it). This weakness makes them unable of basically using magical items. So, adding the wealth measurement to a Vampire is pretty useless, since there's little money can buy that they can use.

Actually its pretty simple to adjudicate, as you touched upon you simply don't use the wealth modifier.

Ill be looking at the leader of the bad ones a little bit later, just wanted primarily to test the Template. CR 56.6.... thats alot.... does all the weaknesses count for much in that estimate?

I may have neglected to factor the weaknesses; I was just going by whats in the tables.

I like the site you referred me to, alot of stuff & hints there...

Hellsing is a fantastic show. I would send you my copies* but a friend of mine keeps forgetting to return them (thats like a year after I lent them to him! The doofus). I'll try and pressure him into returning them.

*VCDs

My own, honest opinion on the Gifts. I think Acid, Sonic & Cold gifts might go against the "feel" of the Vampires. Lightning might be suitable in the way I imagine them now, but otherwise...

I can see all the energy types being used. Remember we are not just dealing with stereotypical 'western' style vampires here. Anything goes. You want to see some of the stuff Alucard (and his opponents) get up to in Hellsing.

Wait until you see this vampire's (Incognito) dancing vorpal tattoos - and thats just for openers:

http://members.lycos.co.uk/hellsingcrypt/incgall1.php

 

[Clay_More]

Where the heck are these rules from?

It seems anethema to what Undeath stands for.

Well, I seen several other kinds of undead that have a special rule that allows them to add their Charisma modifier to their hitpoints, in a similar fashion that constitution normally does (it already adds to their Fort save). Easier than using the many Toughness feats.

How are they paying for it?

Well, they got weaknesses. The inability to use magical items is probably the biggest I know of. Even though theyre ability scores are relatively high, they dont have the advantage of attack bonus boost from weapons, damage bonuses, wands, staff the lot. This is propably the biggest disadvantage. Then, there´s the sun thing & everything else. They are one of the most restricted races to play in that way.

I may have neglected to factor the weaknesses; I was just going by whats in the tables.

Well, when simply dont adjudicate for wealth, theres only the Sun Weakness & the silver weakness left. The Temple weakness (they cannot enter most temples) isnt too bad, since they dont need to go and buy healing potions in the first place.

Hellsing is a fantastic show. I would send you my copies* but a friend of mine keeps forgetting to return them (thats like a year after I lent them to him! The doofus). I'll try and pressure him into returning them.

Gimme gimme

I can see all the energy types being used. Remember we are not just dealing with stereotypical 'western' style vampires here. Anything goes. You want to see some of the stuff Alucard (and his opponents) get up to in Hellsing.

Well, im an open minded guy. But the first version of the vampire, the one that will appear in CoT, will be a distinct western style vampire.. Additions could come later though, in more manga style. Acid, Sonic etc would better fir there

 

[Clay_More]

Storminator.
I was thinking about your statement earlier about the skills. How about this... For every Age Category the vampire advances beyond the first 100 years (not vampiric level, since some vampiric levels originate from generation, not age) it can choose one knowledge skills that it will have as Class Skill?

It wouldn't be too overpowering and would make sense. Okay, it wouldn't benefit Wizards alot, but all the non-knowledge classes would benefit from it.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Clay_More mate!

Well, I seen several other kinds of undead that have a special rule that allows them to add their Charisma modifier to their hitpoints, in a similar fashion that constitution normally does (it already adds to their Fort save). Easier than using the many Toughness feats.

Which official publication is this from?

Gimme gimme

I'll see what I can do.

 

[Clay_More]

It has to be either "Undead" or the "Necromancy" books I got. Those are the two big undead-concerning books I got at home, so. I think it Flesh Minion or something its called that got Cha bonus to hp.
Well, the basic argument is that vampires arent completely undead. They are half-undead, since they are still connected to their flesh & blood. Therefore, they can still have stronger, physical bodies by the empowerment of their strong will, which binds their flesh & blood together...
Dont know if im not making sense, but we Danish seldomly do so....

I have somewhat lacking experience with high CR monsters & stuff.... Normally I keep below 20 CR.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Clay_More mate!

It has to be either "Undead" or the "Necromancy" books I got. Those are the two big undead-concerning books I got at home, so. I think it Flesh Minion or something its called that got Cha bonus to hp.

I don't have either, but I will have a look at them when I am at Gencon UK.

Well, the basic argument is that vampires arent completely undead. They are half-undead, since they are still connected to their flesh & blood. Therefore, they can still have stronger, physical bodies by the empowerment of their strong will, which binds their flesh & blood together...

If you add that ability you are going to have to factor Charisma twice for such creatures, when rating their Challenge Rating.

Dont know if im not making sense, but we Danish seldomly do so....

I think I get the gist of what you mean.

I have somewhat lacking experience with high CR monsters & stuff.... Normally I keep below 20 CR.

Well practice makes perfect.

 

[Clay_More]

Thank, I think it makes sense counting their Charisma twice. Alot of their abilities already depend on Charisma, its a very important ability. All their special ability save DC etc. depend on Charisma. I think a Vampire / Sorcerer would be pretty bad (even though you cant rely on boost spells, but it frees up alot of spells for a sorcerer actually).

Hey, Gencon UK isn't that far from here, compared to the ones in the states. I been thinking of going there, I think there might be a "single" bundle of cash somewhere, perhaps under the couch

Well, I do though have to admit that I think it makes a "little" sense to allow them to have their Charisma modifier to their hp. Even though it does give them rather many HP (as proven above). Even though Rastaniel is the mightiest of em all, so he needs to be cruel like that.

There's some Lightning gifts I made, posted them on Reprieve as well, based on other elemental powers.


Posted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 1:31 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey Dio, seems threads getting long

Anyways, Unholy Speed is best as it is now, with it's separation into two different gifts, in my opinion. The first stuff posted on Enworld is the basics, so to say.

I still think having even scores will fit best. All templates / classes / monster classes I have seen gives even scores. All magical items as well. Only things that do not give even scores are spells, including Wish and level add. So, keeping it even would "streamline" it with other D&D material.

I noticed there is no range max on Fire Gift. Perhaps it should be 30 ft. + 10 ft. / vampiric level.
That way, I also have an easier time making the two gifts different, as Lightning Gift can have longer range (100 ft. + 30 ft. / vampiric level).

Okay, heres a test

Lightning Gift
The Lightning gift is not as feared as the Fire Gift, even though it has some advantages over the more ferocious gift. When a Vampire uses his Lightning Gift, he may shoot a bolt of pure electricity to his target. This bolt causes 1d4 points of damage for each VP spent to power it. The maximum range of the bolt is 100 ft. + 30 ft. / vampiric level. He may only spend a number of VP each round equal to his vampiric level. When the vampire initiates the gift against a target for several consecutive rounds, the bolt simply "attaches" itself to its target, creating a constant, swirling bolt of electricity between the vampire an his target. Even if the target becomes invisible, the bolt will still be attached to him. If he leaves the maximum range of the spell, the bolt will perish.


Storm Gift
The Storm Gift is the natural evolution of the Lightning Gift. The Storm Gift allows a vampire using the Lightning Gift to "lock" his target, once he has attached his Lightning to it. When the vampire attacks a target with his Lightning Gift and he attaches the electric bolt to his target, he has the option of "locking" the target with the powerful bolt. When he lock's his target, it has to roll a fortitude saving throw every round. If it fails, it is unable of moving away from the vampire. It can still move towards the vampire, but the lightning prevents it from moving away. The vampire can always move towards his target, but if he wishes to move away from his target, he has to break the lightning bolt for one round. If the target succeeds in a fortitude saving throw and is able of moving outside the vampires maximum range, the bolt is broken.


Wanted them to be different from the Fire ones though game-mechanics wise.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Clay_More mate!

Thank, I think it makes sense counting their Charisma twice.

A necessity given the mammoth Charisma bonuses you are touting with your vampire template.

Alot of their abilities already depend on Charisma, its a very important ability. All their special ability save DC etc. depend on Charisma. I think a Vampire / Sorcerer would be pretty bad (even though you cant rely on boost spells, but it frees up alot of spells for a sorcerer actually).

Yes I can see such abilities making them very powerful, but probably not unduly so.

Hey, Gencon UK isn't that far from here, compared to the ones in the states. I been thinking of going there, I think there might be a "single" bundle of cash somewhere, perhaps under the couch

Hey! Let me know if you are serious. Obviously I would want to meet up and say hello.

Well, I do though have to admit that I think it makes a "little" sense to allow them to have their Charisma modifier to their hp. Even though it does give them rather many HP (as proven above). Even though Rastaniel is the mightiest of em all, so he needs to be cruel like that.

Its a very powerful addition to undeath. I certainly wouldn't take it lightly.

There's some Lightning gifts I made, posted them on Reprieve as well, based on other elemental powers.

I still think having even scores will fit best. All templates / classes / monster classes I have seen gives even scores. All magical items as well. Only things that do not give even scores are spells, including Wish and level add. So, keeping it even would "streamline" it with other D&D material.

I noticed there is no range max on Fire Gift. Perhaps it should be 30 ft. + 10 ft. / vampiric level.
That way, I also have an easier time making the two gifts different, as Lightning Gift can have longer range (100 ft. + 30 ft. / vampiric level).

Okay, heres a test

Lightning Gift
The Lightning gift is not as feared as the Fire Gift, even though it has some advantages over the more ferocious gift. When a Vampire uses his Lightning Gift, he may shoot a bolt of pure electricity to his target. This bolt causes 1d4 points of damage for each VP spent to power it. The maximum range of the bolt is 100 ft. + 30 ft. / vampiric level. He may only spend a number of VP each round equal to his vampiric level. When the vampire initiates the gift against a target for several consecutive rounds, the bolt simply "attaches" itself to its target, creating a constant, swirling bolt of electricity between the vampire an his target. Even if the target becomes invisible, the bolt will still be attached to him. If he leaves the maximum range of the spell, the bolt will perish.


Storm Gift
The Storm Gift is the natural evolution of the Lightning Gift. The Storm Gift allows a vampire using the Lightning Gift to "lock" his target, once he has attached his Lightning to it. When the vampire attacks a target with his Lightning Gift and he attaches the electric bolt to his target, he has the option of "locking" the target with the powerful bolt. When he lock's his target, it has to roll a fortitude saving throw every round. If it fails, it is unable of moving away from the vampire. It can still move towards the vampire, but the lightning prevents it from moving away. The vampire can always move towards his target, but if he wishes to move away from his target, he has to break the lightning bolt for one round. If the target succeeds in a fortitude saving throw and is able of moving outside the vampires maximum range, the bolt is broken.

Wanted them to be different from the Fire ones though game-mechanics wise.

Interesting! I like them!

Vampires with an ozone flavour.