D&D 5E Was I in the wrong?

[Maxperson]

I'm sure there are lots of ways to spin it. At the end of the day, however, the players are upset because the fiction in their mind was different than what was in the DM's mind. And, here's the thing. The DM knew that their fiction were different. The DM let that happen. On purpose. This is exactly like the player running into the chasm to die, and the DM saying "Your fault."

The DM didn't know until later when he realize that some of the players were upset. Until then, it was just a mistake which could happen.

I honestly don't see how the character wouldn't have seen the gauntlets and ring right there in his face. The blacksmith saw them. They were standing right beside each other. The blacksmith was going over each bit of the armor in question, right there, as the player character watched him. What more do you want? You should always give players the benefit of the doubt.

If I were a shady blacksmith and I saw a ring on the gauntlets, I'd not bring attention to that fact by parading the gauntlets and ring in front of the PC. I'd keep them out of sight and ask my question about selling the armor as a set.

Imagine this scenario:

DM: All doors in the Temple of Kaggoth have two locks. It's one of their things.

later

Player: I search the lock for traps.
DM: You don't see anything.
Player: I pick the lock and open the door.
DM: The door is still locked because you didn't pick the second lock. The trap on the second lock, which you didn't check, goes off.

The player was looking at the door! The DM should remind them that there is, in fact, a second lock.

If the door was actively concealing the second lock in order to hide the ring, then...

It's a slightly different scenario. In your example, there's no way that the two locks are out of sight. With the armor there are ways that the gauntlets and ring could have been.

 

[Lejaun]

Why would he sell it back before ascertaining what those things are worth? He's a businessman, not someone running a charity.

Why wouldn't he? If he doesn't know they are valuable, its no big deal to him if players buy the gear back with maybe a little extra for his troubles. He's still making money.

DM screwed the players, pure and simple, in an act to punish players for out of game activity.

 

[Lejaun]

The DM didn't know until later when he realize that some of the players were upset. Until then, it was just a mistake which could happen.



If I were a shady blacksmith and I saw a ring on the gauntlets, I'd not bring attention to that fact by parading the gauntlets and ring in front of the PC. I'd keep them out of sight and ask my question about selling the armor as a set.



If the door was actively concealing the second lock in order to hide the ring, then...

It's a slightly different scenario. In your example, there's no way that the two locks are out of sight. With the armor there are ways that the gauntlets and ring could have been.

Just like there are ways that the player, taking the armor out of the backpack or whatever they are using, would have seen and been reminded of the odd sight of a gauntlet with a ring (not a typical gauntlet). As the purpose is to sell the armor for money, they would also recognize that a ring might be more valuable to sell individually than as a set.

 

[Maxperson]

Why wouldn't he? If he doesn't know they are valuable, its no big deal to him if players buy the gear back with maybe a little extra for his troubles. He's still making money.

DM screwed the players, pure and simple, in an act to punish players for out of game activity.

I can't appraise a ring, but if I see a ring I'll know that it has some value, possibly a lot of it if I can tell it's gold with gems. If I buy a bundle and it includes a ring and someone then wants to buy it, I'm not going to sell it until I have gotten it appraised so I know what it's worth. It would be exceedingly stupid of me to sell it prior to gaining that information, just as it would have been for the blacksmith.

 

[Maxperson]

Just like there are ways that the player, taking the armor out of the backpack or whatever they are using, could have seen and been reminded of the odd sight of a gauntlet with a ring (not a typical gauntlet). As the purpose is to sell the armor for money, they would also recognize that a ring might be more valuable to sell individually than as a set.

I edited one word for accuracy. It was certainly possible that he could have seen the gauntlets and ring, but it wasn't guaranteed.

 

[ThirdWizard]

If you play D&D because of the loot, more power to you. But that's why I play Diablo III. I play D&D for just these types of occurrences. The unexpected. The fun.

Are we moving onto insults and comparisons to video games and general trolling now? Just checking.

The DM didn't know until later when he realize that some of the players were upset. Until then, it was just a mistake which could happen.

He knew. It's in the original post.

The armorsmith checked it over and when he noticed the ring he casually asked if the whole thing was for sale, making sure not to mention the ring

He knew what he was doing.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

Watch out whenever you are moving towards a "gotcha" type event. The odds are decent that there is a disconnect between the DM and the player(s). A player having to recall that the suit includes the gauntlets, which has a ring stuck on them when they cannot actually see the items, they can only imagine them from the DM description, has a huge potential for mistakes. Sure some players are detail oriented enough to note each of those things, and refer back, but others will not recall, especially when they picked up a list of interesting items as long as the one you listed in the OP. I would find a way to make this right, even if it was only by having the blacksmith having a change of heart and paying them a fair price while suggesting they remember what he did for them.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Once these elements are proven, the D&D Court could ORDER the DM to return his ill-gotten gains from FRAUD.

I can't believe you missed a golden opportunity to work into that lovely dismantling the magic word "disgorge."

Batman would've remembered.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Why wouldn't he? If he doesn't know they are valuable, its no big deal to him if players buy the gear back with maybe a little extra for his troubles. He's still making money.

DM screwed the players, pure and simple, in an act to punish players for out of game activity.

What out of game activity? Do you have info the rest of us don't?

For the record, I consider having your head up your backside and not paying attention to be IN game activity.

 

[Lejaun]

I can't appraise a ring, but if I see a ring I'll know that it has some value, possibly a lot of it if I can tell it's gold with gems. If I buy a bundle and it includes a ring and someone then wants to buy it, I'm not going to sell it until I have gotten it appraised so I know what it's worth. It would be exceedingly stupid of me to sell it prior to gaining that information, just as it would have been for the blacksmith.

Just like its stupid to assume players would willingly sell a ring with armor without finding out its value. Don't forget this little gem from the OP: "they wanted to check the ring and gauntlets." That, without any doubt in my mind, shows that they did not intend to sell the ring and gauntlet. The DM seized upon this as what he saw as a way to get retribution for the phone use.