Ways to stop a powergamer

[Dannyalcatraz]

I'm not that concerned with 200pts of damage in 1 round from Epic level PCs.

But if you're still worried about powergaming in general, here are my 3 big rules:

1) As others have suggested, be very careful about what PrCls you allow. Just because its in print doesn't mean its good for your campaign. A Dragonslayer in a Dragonlance campaign will quickly get out of hand.

2) Treat feats like PrCls. I know I just said it above, but it bears repeating: just because its in print doesn't mean its good for your campaign. If your powergamer favors warrior types, truncate the melee feat trees- eliminate great cleave, whirlwind attack, spring attack, and any 2 weapon fighting skill above improved. Follow analogous rules for ranged combat specialists. Don't let your spellcasters have the higher level item creation feats with which they would arm themselves and partymates with juicy items.

3) Treat Psionics with care. Introducing Psionics can be fun, but if psionic NPCs and Monsters are rare, a psionic PC can be VERY unbalancing.

 

[Oscar carramiñana]

Hi everyone,

In our group there is a powergamer. That is a fact. I am the primary DM (90% of the games are run by me), and I am trying to put some house rules to prevent powergamig. I like a powerful character, but sometimes to threaten the powergamer, I have to put an enemy capable of TPK the other party members.

In the last game we were fighting against a dragon with an armor class of 48, and in one round, he dealt more than 200 hp. We were playing the epic level module from dungeon 93 and he was a 20 level paladin / sorcerer / eldritch knight /spellsword hasted with greataxe, polimorphed in a stone giant, activating arcane strike with a 6th level spell, activating divine might, and making a smite attack in the third attack with a charisma bonus of +8 I think, and thank god he doesnt score a critical. His armor was nearly 40 without a shield, far better than the other 2-handed users of the party. The other members of the party were: a 23 level cleric, a 20 level fighter/rogue, a rogue 21, a monk 22 and a fighter/cleric 20. The dragon survived the attack and in the next round put him in the negatives. After that, the rest of the group managed to kill the dragon with some luck involved.

He always has been a powergamer, but 2 or 3 months ago he discovered enworld (I know now that I should never told him about this site) and has been looking for all kind of ideas about min/maxing his characters. I have been playing with him for 10 years more or less, heck, he was the one who introduced me to roleplay.


As you can see, the other players and I, dont like a lot prestige classes, we use them, but not with every character (I have a rogue/wizard/arcane trickster/archmage for example other player has a fighter/wizard/eldritch knight and other one has a fighter/weapon master)

So what kind of house rules do you think I can put in use to stop him to make all other pc´s be simple followers?

Ah, I forgot

hi Oscar, I know you will be reading this sooner or later.

I'm Oscar maybe a powergamer
Wujenta make this Pc for me to play this module
I only be guilty of play the better what I can to do In a party without a first line fighter 1rogue,1rogue/fighter, 1 monk, 1 cleric, 1cleric/fighter I was the first line fighter hate me for this.
If in a epic party some Pcs must be capable to do 200 hitpoints in a fullround hasted I don't understand a +9 bonus to cha at 20 level I don't think are too much.

Yes my passion even play are make the most powerfull Pcs but Wujenta must recognize to me what after do this PCs I cannot play with it
My most powerfull PC are a dwarf PW20 TWF oriented. WOW
bye wujenta see you later

 

[Thanee]

Make a house rule that any particular PC may only take ONE PrC.

At epic level, this restriction seems kinda harsh.

In a recently started campaign, PCs can only get three classes total (including PrC, pre-epic), that seems like a reasonable restriction, altho it rules out some fun (and not necessarily powergamish) characters, which need more classes to really work.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Oscar carramiñana]

Oscar if you are reading this, you should check out the Min/Maxer heaven of character optimization at the Wizards boards, show your GM what real powergaming is, a correct Hulking hurler build can make a total of 1500 hp per attack!

I'm thinking about this PC long time ago but I have a lot of problems every Pc must survive an exhaustive examination and then he goes to nothing.
I

 

[Oscar carramiñana]

OK, here is a resume

Stat Block
Human, Pal4/Sor6/ElK5/Sps5;
"CR 20; Medium Humanoid; 5'/5';
HD 6d4+5d6+5d8+4d10+80; hp 183;
Init +7; Spd 40 ft/x4;
AC 30;
Atk +29/+24/+19/+14 Holy, Fortunate, Blessed (1d12+14+2d6,19-20/x3, Greataxe +5), +26/+21/+16 Surestriking (1d10+13/19-20/x2, Bastard Sword(martial) +4);
SV Fort +28, Ref +18, Will +21; AL LG;
Str 16(+6), Dex 14(+3), Con 18(+4), Int 12(+1), Wis 10(+0), Cha 24(+9);
Skills & Feats: Concentration¹ +27, Diplomacy¹ +20, Handle Animal +11, Heal¹ +1, Knowledge (arcana) +8, Knowledge (nobilty) +7, Knowledge (religion) +7, Ride¹ +5, Sense Motive¹ +11, Spellcraft +26.
Arcane Strike, Improved Critical(Greataxe), Improved Initiative, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Weapon Focus(Greataxe), Empower Spell, Close-Quarters Fighting, Divine Might, Divine Vigor"

He has casted to enter combat: Haste, Polimorph into stone giant, Greater heroism, and in the round he stroke he activated arcane strike and divine might. So if we were not mistaken he was at +10 to hit (+6 arcane strike, +4 greater heroism) +6d4 damage to every hit (arcane strike) , +9 to damage to every hit (divine might) and strenght 33 (27 base stone giant+6 belt giant strenght) His attacks were: 43/43/38/42(he made smite here)/28 and his damage were 4d6+30+6d4+2d6

Please wujenta don't forgotten +1 for haste and +2 for flanking and +2d6 from holy greataxe+5

 

[Oscar carramiñana]

I wonder why the cleric 23 isn't causing any troubles.. now that's a tough character, he could easily outperform the eldritch knight, if he just made proper use of all the spells at his disposal.

The Dwarf CLE23 of Haela brightaxe are the PC of Wujenta. we usually play with a PC when do as a DM to help the rest 4 PCS are poor for some campaigns this CLE can do 10 or 11 spells.but instead cast implosion or emp max flame strike she cast divine favor. is not my fault if I cast polymorf and goes to kill all I can.
don't worry Wujenta i'm very good friends.

 

[Oscar carramiñana]

Yeah, that is a big difference... creating a character at 20th level and playing one up to 20th level.

Especially, if you allowed him to buy magic items appropriate for his level, while the others had to take what they found (as you said). This might also make up for some difference.

Bye
Thanee

Hi Thanee my PC don't have the items as 20lvlPC Wujenta give all items for play this campaign. in first time I try play with a 20lvl druid but he don't survive the Wujenta's exhaustive scrying the Pal/sor survives with several changes of wujenta.

 

[WizarDru]

IME, that kind of damage at 20th level is nothing terriby amazing.

It has already been pointed out that leveling versus instant creation tends to create dramatically different characters. A 23rd level cleric with a wisdom of 20 is pretty badly hobbled, really.

One thing to consider is that after 16th level, the game becomes very subjective as far as challenges are concerned. Case in point: in my game, the 18th level party was stymied by a CR 23 creature, but as a 19th level party had little difficulty dispatching two CR24 creatures a few weeks later. As a 20th level party, they eliminated an entire cadre of elite Githyanki warriors and spellcasters, including a dozen CR20 creatures, but nearly had their clocks badly cleaned by a CR 21 creature a week later.

The exact nature of such challenges vary dramatically. For example, throwing a high-powered golem at the party may completely stymie the casters in the group, while throwing a super-advanced Beholder or roper may cause the melee characters no end of trouble, but may only require a single spell to incapacitate. At epic levels, maintaining such challenges is more of an artform than a science, to be sure.

If this particular character seems more puissant in combat, you have several options. First, mix up combats more to play to individual members strengths. Don't prevent this player from having his day in the sun...just give others a shot at the same thing. A creature with high DR certainly qualifies for some instances, as does a creature with spell resistance, depending on the target in question.

Mix up the environments they battle in, as well. You'd be suprised how devastating an underwater combat can be, even to a 23rd level party that isn't prepared. Throwing up magical effects that require someone to take them down, such as Depeer Darkness or a wind wall, can change the aspects of combat. Sometimes one of the most rewarding aspects is to make the combat large enough so that everyone has something to do. For example, have a BBEG, but also have some subordinates who must be taken out, or some sideline crisis to be dealt with simultaneously. Fighting a powerful Xorn sorceror who's summoned an earthquake causing the whole dungeon to collapse about the party's head could be a significant problem. Part of the party must defeat the Xorn, while the other part either has to protect the group, secure an escape or prevent the cave-in. Having multiple opponenets is often a good idea, too. A single opponent is too prone to going down fast, and will often be an unassailable target for one or more party members. Share the love.

 

[Bards R Us]

Have the DM release the "Rust monster" Seriously.

 

[Drago]

"In the extreme case, just go hang around the Character Optimization board at the WotC site"

Could you post a link to these boards ?
I've looked around and not found them.

Thanks !!