We saw a Star War! Last Jedi spoiler thread

[Maxperson]

DJ overhears Finn talking with Poe via communicator, who explains the transport escape plan, just prior to their capture. As for how the FO figure out the cloaks, presumably the just *do*, once alerted to the plan. It's not the transport cloaks are presented as revolutionary new technology, more like a desperate trick. Note this is a sensor cloak only - the transports are visible to the naked eye - they could have used optical telescopes.

If it were visual only, the First Order would not have been able to hit the transports as reliably as they were. It's not as if their canons had scopes on them. Somehow they were able to target the fleeing rebels with sensors.

Ever notice how space combat in the Star Wars universe all takes place within the frame? Within visual range. The smaller craft behave like WW2 planes and the bigger craft like ocean-going frigates in a pirate movie. These depictions are governed by visual -- cinematic -- logic, not physics.

Ever single space battle shown in the films is nonsensical from a physics perspective. Ever single one. Search your feelings; you know it to be true.

Not necessarily.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2056018/Laws-physics-change-depending-universe.html

 

[Ovinomancer]

If it were visual only, the First Order would not have been able to hit the transports as reliably as they were. It's not as if their canons had scopes on them. Somehow they were able to target the fleeing rebels with sensors.



Not necessarily.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2056018/Laws-physics-change-depending-universe.html

Bah, the space battles in Star Wars are clearly using turbolaser forms. Linking to stories about electromagnetic forms is silly. Clearly, Star Wars had implied off-screen training with George Lucas in turbolaser forms. Those scientists don't.

 

[tomBitonti]

Something I was just considering ...

While the rebellion took very large losses (three capital ships, most of the escaping rebels), the First Order took much more losses (at least two very large capital ships; an indeterminate number of Star Destroyers). Locally, this looks like a loss for the First Order. (But, I'm not sure how to measure up the loss of leaders.)

That seems to take us to a question of Rebellion losses caused by the Star Killer attack to understand the overall balance of losses.

Also, if the transports weren't attacked, would it have made a difference? In the end, only the Falcon is available as a transport. Anyone above the Falcon's capacity would be left behind and presumably captured or killed by the First Order.

I'm getting annoyed at finding so many things that, ultimately, were irrelevant to the story outcome.

Thx!
TomB

 

[JacktheRabbit]

Something I was just considering ...

While the rebellion took very large losses (three capital ships, most of the escaping rebels), the First Order took much more losses (at least two very large capital ships; an indeterminate number of Star Destroyers). Locally, this looks like a loss for the First Order. (But, I'm not sure how to measure up the loss of leaders.)

That seems to take us to a question of Rebellion losses caused by the Star Killer attack to understand the overall balance of losses.

Also, if the transports weren't attacked, would it have made a difference? In the end, only the Falcon is available as a transport. Anyone above the Falcon's capacity would be left behind and presumably captured or killed by the First Order.

I'm getting annoyed at finding so many things that, ultimately, were irrelevant to the story outcome.

Thx!
TomB

Yes it would have made a difference. The Resistance plan was to stealth to the planet and when the cruiser was destroyed the FO would think the resistance was all dead and not go checking that random planet nearby because they did not see any ships go to it.

Eventually the FO leaves and the Resistance uses their unarmored shuttles to go elsewhere.

 

[tomBitonti]

Yes it would have made a difference. The Resistance plan was to stealth to the planet and when the cruiser was destroyed the FO would think the resistance was all dead and not go checking that random planet nearby because they did not see any ships go to it.

Eventually the FO leaves and the Resistance uses their unarmored shuttles to go elsewhere.

Which brings up a question ... how is the planet which is not reached by jump not apparent to the First Order? There is a whole star system which they were apparently driving past, which no-one was noticing. Wouldn't the First Order, as a matter of course, make sure none of the Rebels escaped to the system, regardless of what they saw on their sensors in regards to departing ships? My brain hurts ...

Thx!
TomB

 

[JacktheRabbit]

Which brings up a question ... how is the planet which is not reached by jump not apparent to the First Order? There is a whole star system which they were apparently driving past, which no-one was noticing. Wouldn't the First Order, as a matter of course, make sure none of the Rebels escaped to the system, regardless of what they saw on their sensors in regards to departing ships? My brain hurts ...

Thx!
TomB

Sure there is a chance they would check the planets, but planets are big things and they might not bother or they might miss the base. Its not the best plan but it was better than what they felt their alternatives were. Poe's plan was better and would have probably worked if leadership had agreed to it and qualified people had been sent to carry it out.

 

[tomBitonti]

Sure there is a chance they would check the planets, but planets are big things and they might not bother or they might miss the base. Its not the best plan but it was better than what they felt their alternatives were. Poe's plan was better and would have probably worked if leadership had agreed to it and qualified people had been sent to carry it out.

Eh, you are chasing a rebel fleet through mostly empty space, except for an upcoming system which has a number of planets. You have a reserve of a dozen Star Destroyers. Wouldn't you send a couple to the system to make sure none of the rebels gave you the slip?

Thx!
TomB

 

[Ovinomancer]

Eh, you are chasing a rebel fleet through mostly empty space, except for an upcoming system which has a number of planets. You have a reserve of a dozen Star Destroyers. Wouldn't you send a couple to the system to make sure none of the rebels gave you the slip?

Thx!
TomB

Why? All the rebels are on THAT ship. They don't leave THAT ship. You blow up THAT ship. Done.

 

[tomBitonti]

Why? All the rebels are on THAT ship. They don't leave THAT ship. You blow up THAT ship. Done.

Because rebels are sneaky sorts who might have tricks that they try to use.

(Now, I can see the First Order blokes, being the arrogant sods that they are, might make that assumption. But, absent critical concerns elsewhere that require the resources, it seems awfully negligent to not take safeguards.)

(On the other hand yet again, both militaries seem rather quite terrible at being military organizations. This would not be out of place for Star Wars.)

Thx!
TomB

 

[Ovinomancer]

Because rebels are sneaky sorts who might have tricks that they try to use.

(Now, I can see the First Order blokes, being the arrogant sods that they are, might make that assumption. But, absent critical concerns elsewhere that require the resources, it seems awfully negligent to not take safeguards.)

(On the other hand yet again, both militaries seem rather quite terrible at being military organizations. This would not be out of place for Star Wars.)

Thx!
TomB

Here's a relevant comparison:

You're in a battleship, chasing an enemy frigate, which is faster than you, but low on fuel. It's only a matter of time before the frigate's fuel reserves deplete and they fall within range of your guns. In addition, you pass by a number of small islands during the chase.

Do you send some of your escorting destroyers to search each island on the chance that the crew of the frigate used camouflaged dingies to sneak off the frigate and might have made it to one of the islands?

We watch the movies where the plucky heroes get away with ludicrous plans against all odds. Most of the time, those don't work at all.