Weak Plothooks

[delericho]

Help out the newbie DM by taking the hook, but also by letting him know later that it was kind of weak. Be clear you are offering constructive criticism, and everyone benefits.

Yeah, that. A newbie needs all the help he can get, both in getting the characters into the adventure, and then in becoming a better DM, and this solution offers both.

 

[Gnarlo]

Sure. God knows I've thrown out a few stinkers now and then, and I've been playing a quarter of a century; if he's a noobie he ain't gonna get experience if you don't bite the bait.

Heck, I've seen countless episodes of sitcoms, dramas, and movies that cost millions of dollars and that teams of people got paid large sums of money to write that were weak piles of crap to come down on some poor schmuck doing the best he can cause he loves the game

 

[Liolel]

In this situation you should always take the hook even if its somewhat out of character. The goal of the game is for the players and the dm to both have fun, and for that to work you sometimes have to play along a little. Besides refusing to bite the hook when the DM has no backup can usually turn a session into a disaster. Although I do agree that after the game you might want to mention to the dm that the hook was somewhat weak.

 

[Numion]

Play your character.

.. but only if your character is someone who's looking for adventure

Or should DMs be prepared to use plot hammers that force PCs in to adventuring, because the players might've made characters that are more into farming?

 

[philreed]

.. but only if your character is someone who's looking for adventure

Or should DMs be prepared to use plot hammers that force PCs in to adventuring, because the players might've made characters that are more into farming?

That could make a great start to a campaign. All of the players are farmers and normal citizens of a village when circumstances force them on an adventure. Their primary goal is to get back to their homes and families but conflict after conflict prevents them from returning to their normal lives.

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

.. but only if your character is someone who's looking for adventure

Or should DMs be prepared to use plot hammers that force PCs in to adventuring, because the players might've made characters that are more into farming?

I don't understand why someone would make an RPG character who's not looking for adventure - but assuming they did, they're probably in for a boring evening.

PLAYER: I ignore the message and go downstairs to open my shop.
DM: Okay, roll 1d6. That's how many customers you get in the morning.
PLAYER: 3.
DM: (rolls) One of them buys a coat hanger. You make 2sp.
PLAYER: And what about the afternoon?
DM: There are no customers that afternoon, they're all forming a posse to go clear out the orc band.
PLAYER: Bah. Okay, I close up.
DM: So you're not going to join the posse?
PLAYER: Nah, reckon I'll have an early night.
DM: You go to bed. Nothing happens during the night.
PLAYER: I get up at dawn and go downstairs to open up.
DM: Okay, roll 1d6...

 

[philreed]

DM: You go to bed. Nothing happens during the night.
PLAYER: I get up at dawn and go downstairs to open up.
DM: Okay, roll 1d6...

I'd go with 1d6-2 -- gotta lose some villagers to the night. If only the PC had gone along with the posse he might have 1d6+1 customers (since the village would be talking about how he helped the posse).

 

[gizmo33]

Heck, I've seen countless episodes of sitcoms, dramas, and movies that cost millions of dollars and that teams of people got paid large sums of money to write that were weak piles of crap to come down on some poor schmuck doing the best he can cause he loves the game

Word.

Good hooks are really hard IMO. Especially when players spend 99% of their effort on their character figuring out what feats to min/max. Sometimes you just don't have a lot to work with.

 

[The_Gneech]

One of the GMs I play under has a real problem translating the forest into trees, when it comes to campaign storyline. For instance, if the object of the game is "Collect the 13 Treasures of Rule," he'll come up with a detailed world for them to be in, a ton of big, bad villains, and then have absolutely no clue how to connect the PCs to it. So he comes up with a scenario based solely on the metaplot, then waits for us to come find it.

We start a lot of adventures something like this...

DM: "Um ... you get to the town, and, um, there's a notice on the tavern wall that Duke Unpronouncible is looking for adventurers."

PLAYER: "Okay, I go up to the bartender and say, 'Ho there! I am Chunk Swordsmite, just returned from forays into the Pomarj. Pour me a mug of your worst swill and tell me about this Duke Unpronouncible and his job offer!'"

DM: "He gets you a drink and tells you where the castle is."

PLAYER: "Ah. Hmm. 'So, my chatty barkeep, is there anything interesting to do in this town?'"

DM: "He tells you some local gossip."

PLAYER: "Well, he's a bundle of fun. I look around the tavern, who else is there?"

DM: "Some townies. Farmers."

PLAYER: "...Uh huh. Fine, I go to the castle. What's the town like?"

DM: "Just a bunch of buildings. With farmers."

PLAYER: "What are they made of?"

DM: "I dunno. Buildings. Anyway, it isn't far to the castle."

PLAYER: "Okay, fine. I assume it's a big stone box with a gate."

DM: "Pretty much."

PLAYER: "Is there a guard outside?"

DM: "Yeah."

PLAYER: "'Ho there! I am Chunk Swordsmite, just retured from forays into the Pomarj. I've come to inquire about Duke Unpronouncible's search for adventurers!'"

DM: "He tells you where the Duke's office is."

...and so on. It sometimes makes it very difficult to actually care whether we find the 13 Treasures of Rule or not. FWIW, he is aware of this issue, and has been getting better over time, but his settings sure are lonely places -- even in a room full of people there's nobody to talk to!

-The Gneech

 

[Wolf72]

this is why I like some of the 1e adventures (by EGG and others) ...

they come out and say: This is the situation, This is why you're here, This is What needs to be done, and This is why you'll do it.

[edit] ... then again I don't mind being shoved in the 'right' direction sometimes, if a DM wants us to find the adventure/hook then s/he needs to say "it's up to you guys what you want to do" ... otherwise they should be informed of what's expected of them.