Weapon Finesse with longsword?

[Phaedrus]

Convince me not to allow Weapon Finesse to work with a longsword. What's the downside?

(and no posts about rule zero, please).

I notice in Wheel of Time D20 that Weapon Finesse works with a Warder's Sword, which is a bastard sword equivalent (provided you can use it one-handed). Why allow this, if not a longsword (and a bunch of other weapons, too)?

 

[Lord Ravinous]

Like the Quarterstaff

 

[Crothian]

Are you in the WoT setting? If so it would be fine as that's a lower magic setting so allowing finess with more powerful weapons would be okay.

 

[CRGreathouse]

It's not an ability given in the PH, or any other WotC book, as a feat.

It's not in the Epic Level Handbook as an epic feat. (Epic feats are like normal feats, but more powerful.)

The WotC website epic feat Wield Oversized Weapon has a specific exception so this isn't possible.

It's in D&Dg as a salient divine ability. (SDAs are generally several epic feats combined, often with an ability that can't be duplicated by mortals.)

 

[Khorod]

The Weapon Master in OA also grants a finesse-like thing with a chosen weapon.

It looks like Weapon Finesse is not supposed to apply to large weapons, because the finesse angle is outweighed by the need for strength. However, there are a few special exceptions around for special experts.

I wouldn't let Weapon Finesse apply straight up to Long Sword because its such a strong weapon- if Weapon Finesse worked, why would the fast guy ever choose rapier?

A prestige class that allow it would probably be okay.

 

[comrade raoul]

Let's not go overboard: mechanically the longsword is just a rapier with a different damage type, that trades a point of threat range for a point of damage. These aren't radically different weapons, and any balance differences will be subtle.

At high levels, where a point of base critical threat range starts to matter more than a point of damage, longswords are weaker than rapiers; the ability to take finesse with them shouldn't break any games. At low levels, the point of extra damage is more significant. It'd be slightly more powerful, but probably not game-breaking.

So I think the reasons to disallow finesse with longswords are conceptual, not mechanical. If the DM feels that it's conceptually appropriate for his setting (perhaps it's wuxia-inspired, or something), then I'd suggest he allow it.

 

[Cyraneth]

If it's a problem, just take up the thinblade.. It's a weapon from Dragon that has all the properties of a rapier (including finesse) and deals 1d8 points of damage.

- Cyraneth

 

[FreeTheSlaves]

I wouldn't have a problem with a player wanting to weapon finesse a longsword. More the question why? Archer? Sure, why not, soon going to introduce a rule where enhancements won't stack. Better prepare a bribe.

We roll organic and the fighters always swap that strength.

 

[Enkhidu]

I'd not allow longswords to be finessed by medium creatures because longswords are heavy bladed slashing weapons (historically called broadswords). Light blades of the same dimensions (used more for peircing than for slashing) are aptly described as rapiers.

Put more succinctly - rapiers don't necessarily all have cup or wire hilts: The sword in the movie Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, for example, was more appropriately modeled as a rapier than a longsword.

 

[Xeriar]

I'd not allow longswords to be finessed by medium creatures because longswords are heavy bladed slashing weapons (historically called broadswords).

They were called hand-and-a-half swords. Broadswords were weapons with a single edge.

Hand-and-a-half swords were called such because, when facing heavily armored opponents, you would wrap your hand around the hilt & bottom of the blade and thrust (ie, pierce).

Light blades of the same dimensions (used more for peircing than for slashing) are aptly described as rapiers.

Rapiers are significantly longer, as in a foot or two longer. And they could slash, too.

Put more succinctly - rapiers don't necessarily all have cup or wire hilts:

Dealing with different periods, and different types of steel, stuff like this will vary. D&D is not about bothering with the mechanics of this type of thing.