jdrakeh
Front Range Warlock
I throw my lot with you. I especially like the idea of rolling dice in the open, with the odds right there on the table for every body to see. If that won't ratchet up some tension, nothing will.
WFRP3e: Dice mechanics
- Thread starter Jan van Leyden
- Start date
I throw my lot with you. I especially like the idea of rolling dice in the open, with the odds right there on the table for every body to see. If that won't ratchet up some tension, nothing will.
Andor
First Post
I think it's very cool. Having different dice types allows the games designer to weight carefully how they want to shape the game. For example in L5R they use a stat + skill system to determine how many dice you roll, but you only keep as many as the stat. Negative modifiers remove dice from your pool. So a character with high stats and low skill will generate higher numbers but also degrade much faster in the face of adversity. Conversely the low stat high skill character will never hit the same heights but will be very consistent and predictable.
By using different dice to represent stats and skill they can be weighted however the game designer wants to reflect that world they want to portray.
And it frankly doesn't look all that hard to use, according to the pdf there are only 8 symbols and they aren't very complex.
It also gives you 3 axis of success with a single roll. The primary effect. Secondary effects. Mystic effects.
So you might fail to climb the tree, but discover a ravens' nest with a shiny ring hidden in it, or climb the tree but snap a branch that attracts the notice of an orc.
By using different dice to represent stats and skill they can be weighted however the game designer wants to reflect that world they want to portray.
And it frankly doesn't look all that hard to use, according to the pdf there are only 8 symbols and they aren't very complex.
It also gives you 3 axis of success with a single roll. The primary effect. Secondary effects. Mystic effects.
So you might fail to climb the tree, but discover a ravens' nest with a shiny ring hidden in it, or climb the tree but snap a branch that attracts the notice of an orc.
They haven't released any info that I didn't hear at Gencon and I was trying not to rehash the same complaints
So my opinion remains the same, this is change for the sake of change. And it's change for the sake of twisting the game to fit FFG's vision of gaming...lots of board-gamey components that they can put in a big box and sell.
The dice are the worst part for me, they are incredibly unwieldy. Dice pool systems need to be treated very carefully so that you're not spending forever throwing and evaluating fist full of dice. This system is the worst of all worlds: custom symbols some of which cancel, some of which cause new rolls (which then may cancel more), all of which need to be 'interpreted' to figure out what happened.
Imagine a point in a game where all the players are rolling at once... not like those are rare... identical dice flying around the table, dice being cancelled re-rolled and interpreted. Yeah, that's convenient.
Not like RPG players like to buy their own die sets either right?
All this to replace a nice fast elegant percentile system. It wasn't broke, it's still being used in Dark Heresy and Rogue Trader, some extremely popular games.
What irritates me the most is I know (ok 95% certain) that this system wasn't developed for WHFRP. The timing doesn't add up, nor do the comments of the FFG staff about the game. This was being developed as Descent the RPG or something similar and got co-opted after the GW license was acquired.
I've been trying to avoid talking about the game but have been keeping my eye on things. I'm still waiting for some revelation that will change my mind. I WANT to like the game, I'm a WH fan, it's just looking unlikely.
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Me, three! Actually, this looks much more like something I could get my daughter and her friends involved in. She loves Runebound and other boardgames because of all the stuff.I throw my lot with you. I especially like the idea of rolling dice in the open, with the odds right there on the table for every body to see. If that won't ratchet up some tension, nothing will.
Frankly, I like how the dice tell a story. Plus, after looking at the dice PDF, the different symbols are not that difficult to interpret.
Looking forward to giving this a try.
This or Dragons Age
Mustrum_Ridcully
Legend
Did I miss the part where they talked about rerolls? I thought they said explicitely: If one of the dice shows a success symbol, it's a success. Seems to me there is no cancelling or rerolling.
mach1.9pants
Hero
Yep
I am not quite there (I don't play WFRP 2e, although I have the book) but this appears to be a very very poor and board/card gamey way to do things, YUCK
As I mentioned in the other 3e thread, this is a brand new game aimed a Warhammer (Online, board, tactical mini) game fans and new fans (the game in a box idea, very newbie friendly) but it is not a new edition aimed
at current 2e players. It couldn't get any more different, it appears bigger than the jump between ADnD and 4E!
CharlesRyan
Adventurer
I throw my lot with you. I especially like the idea of rolling dice in the open, with the odds right there on the table for every body to see. If that won't ratchet up some tension, nothing will.
I'm with the "in favour of it" crowd for now. Truthfully, I don't know whether I'll like it or not--but I can't wait to try it and find out!
The world has plenty of 320-page hardcover rulebooks. It's possible there are other formats/interfaces/methods of play that would work as well or better for RPGs. I'm excited that someone's actually exploring that possibility. Will it be awesome? Who knows? But it's awesome that it's being tried!
Jürgen Hubert
First Post
Looks interesting. I'd have to try it out to see how it works in practice, but it doesn't have to be all that complicated as it sounds like.
I mean, White Wolf games (and a few other games as well) already use dice pool mechanics, and you don't necessarily roll less dice in those. Presumably, the players will know the abilities of their own characters well enough to assemble their dice pools quickly (and switch out Characteristic Dice for Conservative or Reckless Dice as needed). All the GM really needs to do is tell the player the "difficulty" of the attempt - i.e., the number of Misfortune Dice.
I must say, I like the idea of players being able to determine how reckless or careful their characters are going to be, and having this reflected in the game mechanics. Sure, you can represent this all sorts of adjustments in other games, but this might work out a lot smoother under this system, and with a lot less math.
I mean, White Wolf games (and a few other games as well) already use dice pool mechanics, and you don't necessarily roll less dice in those. Presumably, the players will know the abilities of their own characters well enough to assemble their dice pools quickly (and switch out Characteristic Dice for Conservative or Reckless Dice as needed). All the GM really needs to do is tell the player the "difficulty" of the attempt - i.e., the number of Misfortune Dice.
I must say, I like the idea of players being able to determine how reckless or careful their characters are going to be, and having this reflected in the game mechanics. Sure, you can represent this all sorts of adjustments in other games, but this might work out a lot smoother under this system, and with a lot less math.
Mustrum_Ridcully
Legend
Yep, that's pretty much how I feel.
I don't know if it will actually work or if I will enjoy it, I know it is very different from 2e. But it looks really interesting, new, shiny. I want to try it out and see if it works.
I am okay with it not working in the end. I would really love it to see working and seeing it as a start for a new wave of innovation on the RPG market. (Maybe it will do that even if it doesn't work so well after all.)
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