What are good Prereqs for Uncanny Dodge as a Feat?

[DrSpunj]

I'm trying to convert all class abilities into feats for my point system worksheet here. A number of them are giving me some troubles.

Anyone have any good ideas about what kind of prereqs are fair for Uncanny Dodge as a feat? That a Barbarian would meet close to 2nd level and a Rogue by 4th (though I keep thinking the Rogue is getting the short end by having to wait 2 additional levels)?

Here's the ability:

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): [You] can react to danger before [your] senses would normally allow [you] to do so. [You] retain [your] Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, [you] still loses [your] Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized.

As a "sixth sense" I can see a Wisdom requirement, and since it only helps if you have a positive Dex bonus I can see that as well (I'm not worried about changing the ability a bit here, as long as it works similarly).

I'm stuck! Please help!

Thanks.

DrSpunj

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

AU has Wis 11+ as the ony prereq (other than a truename), but that's a bit low for a normal D&D game. I'd suggest Wis 13+ and Dex 13+.

 

[DrSpunj]

Doh!

Totally forgot about AU having something similar. There it's called Sense the Unseen or something, isn't it?

EDIT: It's Intuitive Sense, and it's only prereq is a Truename. Hmmm, I'm pretty sure I'm going to use Truenames in my new campaign, but that doesn't help what to do with Core. And while I agree with the Wis 13+ & Dex 13+ requirements, I'm not sure it's fair to require all Barbarians & Rogues to have those ability scores. Bleah. :\

And have you done much playing with the worksheet, JQM?

Thanks.

DrSpunj

 

[Darklone]

Hmm. Since I always liked my chars to have Uncanny Dodge AND a low Wisdom... I DISAGREE

 

[DrSpunj]

Hmm. Since I always liked my chars to have Uncanny Dodge AND a low Wisdom... I DISAGREE

Right. That's what I'm thinking, too. The Wisdom makes some sense to me, like it does for the Blindsight 5' radius feat (though I think that's 19+, IIRC) but I don't want to discrimintate against all the dumb Barbarians & Rogues out there.

But is Dex 13+ enough? Since I'm moving more towards a concept-based game (rather than classes) I'm fine with anyone who wants this to take it, but I think it should at least have the same prereqs as Dodge. I'm just unsure whether it's more powerful than Dodge, and if so, by enough that it deserves tougher prereqs. Monte doesn't seem to think so.

Thanks.

DrSpunj

 

[Nifft]

A high base Reflex save. That way, Rangers, Rogues and Bards can have it earlier than anyone else, which makes a little sense. (Barbarians can't, but a Barb3/Rogue 2 should be able to get it).

Requirements: Dodge, Base Reflex Save of 4+, Wisdom of 11+ and Dex 13+.

-- N

 

[Darklone]

I would drop the Wisdom prerequisite and add Improved Initiative or some other feat for nervous people

 

[Marshall]

IIRC, UD, not IUD, is allready part of the Combat Reflexes feat....

 

[DrSpunj]

Requirements: Dodge, Base Reflex Save of 4+, Wisdom of 11+ and Dex 13+.

Do any other feats have an ability prereq of 11+?

And I can't agree with Dodge as a prereq. Uncanny Dodge isn't a "second tier" feat, IMO, and Core Barbarian's & Rogue's don't have anything remotely like Dodge as class features.

I'm not looking for an Uncanny Dodge-like feat to offer a non-Barb, non-Rogue PC (like a straight Cleric or something). I'm looking to turn the Barb/Rogue Uncanny Dodge class ability into a feat, and I think it needs to have prereqs that most Barbs & Rogues can meet by ~3rd level.

Dex 13+ makes a lot of sense to me, and I can see a Reflex requirement as well (but that doesn't work for the Core Barb, only the Rogue).

Thanks.

DrSpunj

 

[Nifft]

In that case: Dex 13+, and either Base Reflex Save 3+ or BAB +3 and Base Speed 40+ ft. This feat does not function in Heavy armor.

-- N