What classes will be in the martial power book?

[Zaruthustran]

Do we know, conceptually, what the Martial Power book is going to be about? Is it new classes? Expanded options for existing classes? New Paragon paths? New feats? All of the above?

I can see additional paragon paths being a good addition to the game, as well as feats and items. And maybe a new class or two. I hope they don't expand existing classes, though. If I make a first level Fighter, I want to only have to consult a single book when determining his core class features.

I knew 3E was broken when I went to create a fighter/cleric for an eberron campaign, and I had to use the FLOOR instead of a table because I had these books open and spread around:

PHB
PHB 2
Eberron campaign setting
Player's Guide to Eberron
Races of Eberron
Explorer's Handbook
Book of Exalted Deeds
Heroes of Battle
Complete Warrior
Complete Divine
Complete Adventurer
Unearthed Arcana
Races of Destiny
Spell Compendium

Good grief. Talk about rules bloat.

In fact that awful, aggravating, 6-hour experience was what made me give up 3E. And it's why I'm really, really excited about the Digital Initiative. I want to be able to tell WotC's site which books I own, and have it produce a SINGLE collection of feats from all my many sources. Which I can then sort by category (say by cutting any nonapplicable feats, like feats for arcane casters, or for races other my own), and then print. Or, better yet, import into an online character generator which goes the extra step of calculating all the modifiers from my feat, race, class, and item choices.

My god, such a utility would be *so* worth ten bucks a month.

EDIT: oops, put "races and classes" where I meant "martial power book". Fixed.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Do we know, conceptually, what Races & Classes is going to be about? Is it new classes? Expanded options for existing classes? New Paragon paths? New feats? All of the above?

Um, Races & Classes is the player preview book for 4e. It's available now at your FLGS!

Brad

 

[Kaodi]

Hmmm... I am going to suggest that a martial controller might be some sort of Savant, a combination alchemist/engineer/newtype that sees the physical battlefield as a realm of possibilities, perhaps kind of like putting Batman and Action Man together into one badass opponent.

 

[The Little Raven]

Hmmm... I am going to suggest that a martial controller might be some sort of Savant, a combination alchemist/engineer/newtype that sees the physical battlefield as a realm of possibilities, perhaps kind of like putting Batman and Action Man together into one badass opponent.

Part of the issue is constructing a "non-magical" person that can deal AoE damage and manipulate the terrain of the battlefield, without the explanation of consumables (like alchemist items) so that it fits into the at-will, per-encounter, per-day mold. That's the toughest part of making a martial controller a thunderstone-thrower.

 

[Silent Cartographer]

I agree that this book may not contain any new classes.

It looks to me like Rogue is the new base swashing class, rather than Fighter. I definitely see the Swashbuckler as a martial striker with some secondary control powers.

I always just assumed that the Monk would be a martial controller; where else would you put them? YAMS (yet another martial striker)? As far as AOE powers go, I can easily see adjacent radius and line area effects. Combine wicked-high movement and lots of martial-based denial powers, and you have the monk. I see striker as a seconday role...

 

[rkanodia]

Part of the issue is constructing a "non-magical" person that can deal AoE damage and manipulate the terrain of the battlefield, without the explanation of consumables (like alchemist items) so that it fits into the at-will, per-encounter, per-day mold. That's the toughest part of making a martial controller a thunderstone-thrower.

I honestly don't have a problem with an alchemy-based character conveniently reaching into his ass^h^h^h utility belt and grabbing just enough items to fill out his per-encounter powers, but I think that the 'realism' crowd would have an aneurysm over it, so it's going to be a non-starter from WotC's standpoint. A third-party PDF, on the other hand...

 

[Fallen Seraph]

Hmm... What about a controller that uses a crossbow.

A crossbow can be used in a number of different ways and bolts can be more varied then arrows, which could lead to battlefield control.

 

[TwinBahamut]

If it is impossible to make a Martial Controller, than I say that the new role system is fatally flawed. If only Wizards and Wizard-like things can actually perform as a controller, then "Controller" is just an alternate term for "party Wizard", and the role system is just a way of covering up the fact that few things have changed from the old system. However, I have not given up hope on the new system yet, so I am going to believe that a Martial Controller is possible.

One possible Martial Controller would be a classic cavalry character. A kind of powerful mounted warrior who can smash through large groups of enemies at once, breaking up formations and sending his foes into panic. Charges in 10ft x 60ft lines that trample enemies, knock them away, cause fear, etc.

Alternatively, a kind of skilled Swordsage who can use extremely elaborate moves that hit multiple enemies (improved Whirlwind attacks?), throws, paralyzing strikes, deathblows, etc, would be a pretty good Martial Controller.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Once again consulting the holy text of Races & Classes...

The controller specializes in dealing damage or inflicting conditions on multiple targets at once, usually at range. They might do less damage per target than the striker, but they're in their element when they can catch multiple foes at once.

DEFINATELY sounds like something a non-ki, non-psionic Monk could do (speedy mc flurry-of-blows, there).

Also sounds like something a dervish of some sort could do.

Something a Master Thrower could do.

Sounds like something a Wuxia-style swordsman could do, too.

So, yeah, going by the mantra of "hurts big areas, doesn't hurt 'em really badly, kills lots of minions," martial controllers are not too hard to think of.

 

[Mouseferatu]

If it is impossible to make a Martial Controller, than I say that the new role system is fatally flawed. If only Wizards and Wizard-like things can actually perform as a controller, then "Controller" is just an alternate term for "party Wizard", and the role system is just a way of covering up the fact that few things have changed from the old system.

I don't think those two facts are automatically correlative. Even if you can't have a martial controller, that doesn't automatically mean you couldn't have a divine controller, or a psionic controller, or a shadow-based controller, or... or... or...

The fact that one couldn't have a martial controller--if that does, indeed, turn out to be a fact--is hardly the same thing as saying "controller = wizard."