What do you do with a cheating player!

[Piratecat]

I had one cheating player; he'd make up money to add to his character sheet, and cheat on all of his dice rolls. I eventually decided to stop inviting him.

We both played in another DM's campaign, though. There his rampant cheating was no secret at all. Once the player couldn't make the game so his monk PC was being run as a NPC. The DM asked another player to roll initiative for the monk. "I rolled a 5," the other player said. "So he goes on 24." We all laughed after the joke sank in, but it was definitely not because it was all that funny. I wish that DM had confronted him, too; it would have made the rest of the players a lot happier.

Don't be afraid to disallow little tiny hard-to-read dice, either. Some folks use those (or dice rollers on PDAs) to fudge their rolls.

 

[Li Shenron]

Be aware that in my experience a player who cheats on his dice is really likely to cheat in other ways - futzing modifiers, changing money and xp totals, and so forth. Make sure you have an accurate copy of his character sheet.

I think that is definitely even more common than cheating on the dice results...

I have seen it only when we played OD&D about 8 years ago, a couple of players cheated often (or at least I got that impression, I am pretty sure I have noticed right, but I didn't come up and tell everyone...). The very strange fact is that those persons NEVER cheated in any other games we usually played - or if they did, they were so good than no one noticed - they instead cheated only in D&D even if the first thing our first DM explained to us was that there is no winner or loser in a RPG.
It's possible that the reason came from frustration, since half of the players couldn't play the character they wanted because of that edition's harsh restrictions.

 

[Grazzt]

Insist on having copies of their characters, with all resources listed. You need this anyway, to make sure you design encounters they can beat. Also house rule that if it isn't on your copy of their character it doesn't exist. This is to motivate them to keep their character record updated for you. This also covers you when the cheater tries to cheat. "Sorry, that isn't on the character sheet."

We used to do that. Not so much because of a cheater, but we (me and a friend who DM'ed from time to time) kept copies so we could design stuff around the party's strengths and weaknesses. And it did help against any sort of cheating.

A guy I used to play with (he DM'ed) had a standing rule that unless your PC earned the XP, items, whatever in his campaign, it didnt exist. This was basically because we had a player who played the same character in a lot of different addys with other DMs (he said) and always seemed to come to the table each week stockpiled with newer and more powerful crap.

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

It's not Morrus, is it? (this is assuming you're the same Al I'm thinking of)

Seriously, The best alternative as I see it is to have a personal chat with him - not with the whole group, because it may seem too much like some kind of weird intervention. Just discuss that you've seen him messing with his rolls, and it's getting to the point where it's getting kind of obvious to the whole group. Don't use the word "cheating" as that is a harsh word and you don't want to lay down the law just yet. Just use "messing with", "spoofing", "fibbing", or whatever works for you. Just lay it on the line that it's no fair for the other players, and that you want all of you to have fun. See if you can get him to agree that, if he gives you as DM a fair shake, you'll give him fair treatment. Be as friendly as possible, because you're two friends talking about a disagreement at this point, not two adversaries.

If he runs from it or hides it, then you and the rest of the group have to decide one of two courses: either put up with it, or lay down the law with him. If you lay down the law, you simply have to tell him that his messing with his rolls is no fun for anyone, and he needs to stop. He'll need to roll with at least one witness, or you'll have to start rolling for him. It he can't accept that, then he won't be invited back.

It depends on whether or not he's worth keeping. The above assumes he's VERY worth keeping, as implied in your post.

Please note that my suggestions are based on my own personal experience, and implies no guarantee - in fact, my suggestions may be void where prohibited by law.

Good luck.

Same Al, different playing group... confusingly enough.

Besides, Morrus is our DM and everyone knows a DM can't cheat.


I guess dressing it up as 'messing with' rather than 'cheating' does make it all a little more palatable. A friendly chat might work. Just treat the whole thing as a minor game issue rather than anything to get bothered about.

I would like to keep the player around. He's good fun with the non dice rolling parts. Generally a nice guy as well.

Putting up with it, like a few other people have suggested could be workable... Although I'm not sure I'd want to fudge monsters dice rolls, just against him. I'd feel like I was sinking to the same level. Guess it feels pretty theraputic though!



I collect character sheets at the end of each session and take them away with me - used to have a problem with people losing/forgetting them. I also keep a note of stats, key skills, etc for rolls I don't want the players to know about. I normally cast my eye over them each week, pretty sure I'd notice anything other than a minor discrepancy.

 

[Castellan]

Ultimately, confronting the player in as nice a way as possible is the best solution. Practice the art of diplomacy and make sure you're not sounding too accusatory. (Incidentally, using DMing terms like, "You seem to roll high quite often," and, "You appear to be successful more often than not," is better than sticking with absolute statements like, "You always roll high," or, "You never fail a check.")

You could even work on a way to help the player want to fail a roll. Develop a sub-plot that involves the player's character. Take him aside before the game session and tell him, "I've got this really cool idea for you character..." Give him just enough details to get hooked on the idea of his PC being the center of attention for a game session or three (bait...), and then tell him the catch is that it can only happen if his PC fails enough rolls (...and switch).

I've often found that providing the player with a clear-cut understanding that failing a roll can sometimes be a good thing will help to change the compulsion. Just don't forget that one time is probably not enough. You'll have to coax the player along by dangling the occasional carrot. (Make sure you don't do this so much that he starts to expect it as a reward for cheating, and make sure the other players know what you're trying to do so they can get in on the congratulatory behavior without feeling like they're being short-changed.)

I had a player at one point that rolled unusually high. It started subtly enough, though after a few rolls I began to record the result. Her die was statistically the best I had ever seen -- never rolling below a 15 on a d20. The real problem came from the "creep" that began to occur. Eventually, she was rolling natural 25s on a d20. And then it became "time to talk."

If you can't get the cheating under control, then you definitely should have a talk with the player, but try encouraging good play, first.

 

[Gnarlo]

It's unfortunate but I have to agree, once bitten by the dice cheat, he'll fudge a lot of other stuff You can at least slow down the dice cheating by using a box like said above, or go the dice roller route.

 

[Ylis]

Ah! And if you have the players choose a surface to roll on in full view of everyone else, be careful that they don't use clear dice w/white numbering on white paper (such as the character sheet)! The person sitting beside them won't even be able to see what the die says, so the player can cheat with the illusion of following the guidelines. I've had that happen before...

 

[Marimmar]

I have the unfortunate experience of having two cheating players in the games I'm playing in. You cannot control every aspect of the game in such a way as to prevent cheating altogether but here are some ways of slowing it down:

1) Make snide remarks in front of others about his cheating. Don't be afraid to lose him over that, he's so eager to play the game and 'winning' it that he's cheating. This usually leads to a much reduced amount of roll-fudging.

2) Have other players verify rolls made by everyone else. As a DM you're usually too far away to control every roll made but the players aren't. This leads to a bit of intra-party distrust but is worth the hassle.

3) Have everyone use a dice-box, disallow any rolls where the dice do not come to rest underneath it and noone saw the result. Also disallow any lifting of the dice-box without having someone seen the dice-box being shaken beforehand. (A nice way to cheat is to roll 'absentmindedly' a few times, taking a peek at the result and the then present a high roll as your next d20 result.)

4) As a DM try to be as honest as possible with the players, sometimes your BBEGs will fail their saves early on, sometimes they won't. Being fair as a DM sets an example to the players. After all, you're the one who could cheat all day long if he wanted to, making die rolls completely unnecessary.

5) Confrontation-Confrontation-Confrontation! Always confront him when he cheats, telling him how disappointed you are by his cheating and that it's not nice towards the other players who do not fudge rolls.

6) Have someone at least keep track of XP, HPs, Gold and Magic Items in your campaign.

Finally, don't be afraid to talk to him, this is a matter of trust between friends and cheating is abusing this trust.

~Marimmar

 

[jasper]

When I was addicted to D&D and would allow bad people um players to play because I must play the game this is generally what I did.
Talk to the bad player.
Talk to rest of the group.
Allow the bad player to player but discount his rolls. Ok Gary you did 18 pts to orc while I marked off 4.
As I grew up and lost my addiction to D&D I would throw players out (some would straight up others still don’t talk with me) or quit gaming with problem children. I recently back into my old group due to a location shift.

they're a good friend and I don't want to fall out with them over a game.,, Hey AL if they a good friend and you call them on and they leave then you will just some of your associates are not your friends no matter how often they hang with you.

A guy I used to play with (he DM'ed) had a standing rule that unless your PC earned the XP, items, whatever in his campaign, it didnt exist. This was basically because we had a player who played the same character in a lot of different addys with other DMs (he said) and always seemed to come to the table each week stockpiled with newer and more powerful crap.

I had those players So I had cloning. You could clone your character into or from another world. If from another world I got final say on all thing brought into MY world.

 

[MarauderX]

Roll for him. Or assign him a designated roller.