What do you think about magic item creation times?

[Vague Jayhawk]

I play a Battlesmith in one of my games.

The amount of time it takes to craft a magic item doesn't cheese me off nearly as much as the time it takes to make a non-magic item.

When making non-magical items it is calculated using copper pieces per day. Using CPS/day or SPS/week it takes months to craft a weapon that is suitable for the +1 enchantment that takes 2 days.

 

[Ed_Laprade]

I haven't run into that issue in any of my games yet. However, one of the players in my homebrew game wanted to make some scrolls and potions. After discussing it with him, we decided the rules didn't make any sense. It takes a whole day to scribe one scroll? Seems a bit extreme. So for my game we modified the rules. I allow him to make up to 4 1st level scrolls per day (avg day = 8hrs) or up to 4 1st level potions per day. Basically, the ruling is 2hrs per spell level. The higher the level spell scrolls and potins he wants to make, the longer it will take. Also, to make potions in my game, the PC needs ranks in Craft-Alchemy as well as the Brew Potion feat.

Why only an 8 hour day? If the setting is anything like the middle ages it should be a 12-16 hour day. And no time off just because the sun went down, that's what Light spells are for!

 

[Ed_Laprade]

I play a Battlesmith in one of my games.

The amount of time it takes to craft a magic item doesn't cheese me off nearly as much as the time it takes to make a non-magic item.

When making non-magical items it is calculated using copper pieces per day. Using CPS/day or SPS/week it takes months to craft a weapon that is suitable for the +1 enchantment that takes 2 days.

Yeah, that's nonsense. I've watched Ren Faire weaponsmiths hammer out a sellable sword in about an hour. Hardly masterwork, but that sure shouldn't take months!

 

[Nightfall]

If it's something that needs to be made now, I'll waive the time constraints. Besides not like every day they adventure.

 

[Kerrick]

Do you mean anyone-you-know "anyone," or anyone "anyone?" Because it's definitely common in my games!

Anyone I know, I guess. We have seven people in our group, three of whom rotate DMing duty, so six players at any given time in three campaigns. Out of all the PCs we have, I can count on one hand the number who've taken item creation feats, and still have fingers left over. I honestly don't know why we never take them; it's not really an issue of downtime, despite my original question, because the DMs are more than happy to give us the time to make things.

I suppose I never bother because I'm a low-magic person - the few times I've made PCs above 1st level, I have trouble picking out magic items beyond the basic stuff - armor, weapon(s), a protective item or two, and maybe a miscellaneous item.

The amount of time it takes to craft a magic item doesn't cheese me off nearly as much as the time it takes to make a non-magic item.

When making non-magical items it is calculated using copper pieces per day. Using CPS/day or SPS/week it takes months to craft a weapon that is suitable for the +1 enchantment that takes 2 days.

Try this out for size. I had the same gripes you did with the crafting system, so I came up with my own version, where the crafting time is set, not based on the cost (that, IMO, is one of the stupidest systems I've ever seen). If you want to make a masterwork item, it simply multiplies the time.

Yeah, that's nonsense. I've watched Ren Faire weaponsmiths hammer out a sellable sword in about an hour. Hardly masterwork, but that sure shouldn't take months!

Agreed, it shouldn't take months; I did some research when I was doing up my crafting system, and general consensus (for a good sword that can be used in battle) is about a week - you have to shape the iron, quench it, sharpen the blade, make the hilt and bind it to the blade, wrap the hilt, etc. I'm thinking the Ren Faire swords are like the orc swords from the Lord of the Rings movie - they can churn them out in an hour or two, but they're cheap and liable to notch/break with a good blow (say, on a natural 1) - the perfect weapon for expendable troops.

 

[Kerrick]

Something I yoinked from a friend's campaign - you can brew multiple doses of the same potion at the same time, up to 1000gp per day. Doesn't affect everything, but does make potions from being a much greater time sink then everything else.

I like this one too. I was talking to a friend earlier, and he said that potionmaking should properly be placed under Craft (alchemy), which makes sense. If you go this route, making a potion would be DC 7+spell level; each additional potion increases the DC by +2, to a maximum of five potions (DC 17). You pay full cost for the first potion and 50% of the cost for each additional one (since you're making them from a large pool of ingredients). The main problems here are: a) it would take far too long to make them with the existing crafting system; and b) you'd have to ditch the Brew Potion feat (or, see below). XP cost would go away, but since it's negligible for potions anyway, it's no great loss.

If you already have the Brew Potion feat, you can consider it to be a Skill Focus feat for potions only - it'd give you an additional +3 bonus to make them, which stacks with the bonus from Skill Focus (Craft [alchemy]).

 

[Ed_Laprade]

Agreed, it shouldn't take months; I did some research when I was doing up my crafting system, and general consensus (for a good sword that can be used in battle) is about a week - you have to shape the iron, quench it, sharpen the blade, make the hilt and bind it to the blade, wrap the hilt, etc. I'm thinking the Ren Faire swords are like the orc swords from the Lord of the Rings movie - they can churn them out in an hour or two, but they're cheap and liable to notch/break with a good blow (say, on a natural 1) - the perfect weapon for expendable troops.

Yep, that's why I said sellable. It only has to look good enough to hang on a wall. And for some, the crude, Orkish look is a plus!

 

[AuraSeer]

Epic items are even worse, with their costs in the millions - it'd take upwards of 3 years to make a simple set of +10 amor (1 million gp).

If you're going to make epic items, take the Efficient Item Creation epic feat. It reduces creation time by 90%.

That suit of armor will still take a few months to complete, but remember this is an Epic item you're talking about. It's supposed to be a legendarily powerful item in its own right, the possession of the mightiest of heroes. Items like that don't get cobbled together in an afternoon.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

The time they take is not long enough IMHO!

I agree. Creating powerful magic should require a lot of time invested.

 

[kigmatzomat]

I like the rules and I have several players IMC who have/had item crafting characters; the cleric was retired recently, we've had 3 people play wizards who had to drop out, the guy who played a druid swapped it for a ranger, etc. I think there have been a couple suits of armor, several cloaks, boots, goggles, quite a few potions and scrolls, a statue of atonement and a puzzle crypt of resurrection (it was a gnome cleric, what can I say).

I don't have MagicMarts IMC but the the party has paid to have lots of magic items commissioned. Matter of fact there are several items currently being created right now (headband of wis+6, a ring of blinking, and a ring of evasion) that won't be done for a few more weeks of game time. The PCs have to find wizards capable & willing to make the items who are not currently occupied. In some cases, it has meant waiting several months to get an item with a particularly onerous pre-req.

The party prefers to take some time off, in-character, to relax, handle business & paperwork, buy property, and do adventure-support tasks like item creation and research. Since my campaign has run for ~6 years (game time & IRL) it works out.