D&D 5E What does 5E do well?

[MichaelSomething]

I have posted many times, on several different forums for people to show these expedited combats that are talked about. I have asked for people to video a combat, at tenth level, for any edition of D&D 3.5 and up, that runs quickly (30 minutes). I have never had a taker. Not one. (I have had many people just tell me that they do it, and I can accept their word as truth.) I have been to convention after convention (GenCon, GaryCon, OrcCon, StrategiCon, etc.) and have never seen a table playing above 5th level able to have a 30 minute battle.
The point is, I have tried to look specifically looked for this holy grail because there are many that say they do this, and I would like to run my games that way. I think it is better for the story. So I want to learn. But, it does not seem to exist. There are threads all over the place about ways to decrease combat time. Yet, even with those implemented, at 10th level, all newer editions are slugs.
If I am wrong, please please please tape your next session and show me how it is done. I want to learn. But after 15 years of trying find the grail, it seems that it does not exist.

I had single combats that took whole 4 hour sessions. The bridge fight in Red Hand of Doom can take a long time. Five PCs at level 5 versus a dragon, nine hobgoblins, and two Hell Hounds. That's about a CR 10.

The only stories I heard of fast high level combat is when a wizard kills a BBEG during round one with a spell

 

[Scott Christian]

That seems like an oddly specific bar. Any reason why 30 minutes for a level 10 fight? Is it just an arbitrary pick?

Any effect in the game that controls, removes, or otherwise disables a creature can lead to incredibly quick fights in 5E. Especially when it’s a group vs a solo monster if they don’t have legendaries. Even with, a group burning legendary resistances then going to control or polymorph the enemy can be very fast combats.

The lost common response I see is people saying to have alternate win conditions instead of a straight fight to the death. That can help a lot, too.

When I say it, I do not mean for it to be that specific. 40 minutes, sure, I will take it. 45 minutes, okay, I guess. But the point of the time is simply to state: show me a combat that is quick, ie. around thirty minutes.

Spoiler - It never happens.

I can concur with others in saying that 4e is hyper-prone to player numbers increasing combat time by very large amounts. 4 players, which for the last 15 years for me, is the rarest of rarest magical tables. 3 would be a dream.

And you are right, there are the exceptions in combat. No doubt. I have seen a few, been part of a few, and DM'd a few. That said, they are the exception. If the players and DM like strategy, then more often than not, the DM changes the variables in an encounter to help give it some nuance and/or fun quirk. That often boils down to not allowing the players to use the same trick over and over again.

Even when using an AP, combat takes a while. We are playing Chult right now, and faced some velociraptor style dinos and one big guy named King of Feathers (He was very cool). Five players, sixth level, all experienced, big damage dealers, and it still took us one and a half hours.

 

[Fanaelialae]

I had single combats that took whole 4 hour sessions. The bridge fight in Red Hand of Doom can take a long time. Five PCs at level 5 versus a dragon, nine hobgoblins, and two Hell Hounds. That's about a CR 10.

The only stories I heard of fast high level combat is when a wizard kills a BBEG during round one with a spell

Yeah, this was my experience as well. The longest fights in D&D that I've ever experienced were in 3.x. We had a few high level combats go most of a 6-8 hour session (each) iirc.

It think 4e combat might have been a bit slower than 3e at lower levels, but IME it was a bit faster at higher levels. I'd say 5e probably averages the fastest encounters out of the three, at least at my table.

 

[clearstream]

I think you're coasting on a good DM and a great group there But what do I know, right? Honestly. Not everything lol.

It has been my experience that the tables that work, work because the group at that table have the ability to make it work. No matter the system. System is secondary in RPG.

5e is great if you like the mythic-medieval mosaic that it presents, sophisticated D&D mechanics, and expansive character development arcs. I've played campaigns of 70+ contiguous sessions with characters levelling 1-15 and the system has opened up more to characters all the way through. Few other games are even close, in blending streamlined rules with long mechanical character-development arcs.

 

[Oofta]

...
The only stories I heard of fast high level combat is when a wizard kills a BBEG during round one with a spell

Back in LG (3.5) days, one of the authors of mods (these were specific to the living campaign) would sometimes request that I be part of the group that helped test the mod before it was released to make sure everything was clear and that the encounters were relatively evenly balanced. Unfortunately I'd almost always find a way to get to or take out the BBEG, typically in the first round or two.

I'm not sure it was a good thing, because the BBEG just got progressively more difficult.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

It has been my experience that the tables that work, work because the group at that table have the ability to make it work. No matter the system. System is secondary in RPG.

It's definitely secondary, but a bad enough or incompatible enough system can cause a good group who have worked well for years to throw up their hands in disgust, and a really good system can make them better than they thought they could be. My main group has been together for 30+ years, and we've played a ridiculous number of systems. Some we've loved, some we've hated, some we've thought were merely okay. To be honest even when I was done with 4E due to the time taken, my group still wanted to play it. We played a hacked-together Cortex Prime thing I'd literally written up over the week tonight and it worked great! (I was doing a Mass Effect hack of my own devising, borrowing from Fate Accelerated and some other ME hacks, both Fate-based and Cortex Plus - not Prime - based).

Few other games are even close, in blending streamlined rules with long mechanical character-development arcs.

This is actually true and I should give D&D 5E a solid B maybe even B+ for this.

I think there are quite a number of places it falls down (particularly that some character classes get way more engaging development than others), stopping it getting an A, but it is good at this, better than most editions and certainly most games. One game I'd personally say is clearly better at the same thing is Earthdawn, but D&D definitely is doing job.

I actually think this is pretty important too because one thing a lot of more successful RPGs share is pretty good long-term character development, and one thing a lot of extremely well-designed but less-successful RPGs lack is that. Makes me hopeful for the long-term for RPGs like Spire and Heart, which have some really nice character development.

 

[Sithlord]

One thing that could speed up play. I learned this from a DM in the 80s when I first started playing. We all do this where I play locally. Although not in flgs unless I or one that learned under my DM or someone under him is that when it’s your turn you have 6 seconds to declare your action. If you have to look up a spell or monster in a book it doesn’t happen. You better have your spell on a spell card and know what it does. If you summon a creature you better have its stats ready or it doesn’t happen. If you are a fighter and can’t decide what maneuver. You better quickly say I hit it with my sword or whatever. Now we don’t have an exact timer. And you better have a pertinent question if u need a clarification. Our combats go pretty quickly. And people pay attention.

 

[hawkeyefan]

I have posted many times, on several different forums for people to show these expedited combats that are talked about. I have asked for people to video a combat, at tenth level, for any edition of D&D 3.5 and up, that runs quickly (30 minutes). I have never had a taker. Not one. (I have had many people just tell me that they do it, and I can accept their word as truth.) I have been to convention after convention (GenCon, GaryCon, OrcCon, StrategiCon, etc.) and have never seen a table playing above 5th level able to have a 30 minute battle.
The point is, I have tried to look specifically for this holy grail because there are many that say they do this, and I would like to run my games that way. I think it is better for the story. So I want to learn. But, it does not seem to exist. There are threads all over the place about ways to decrease combat time. Yet, even with those implemented, at 10th level, all newer editions are slugs.
If I am wrong, please please please tape your next session and show me how it is done. I want to learn. But after 15 years of trying find the grail, it seems that it does not exist.

I’m gonna need proof that you’ve asked multiple people to provide video of their fast combats.

 

[MerricB]

My experience is that 3E took progressively longer as you gained levels, at least partly because there was so much fiddly maths involved. Between Power Attack, iterative attacks with different attack bonuses, and trying to work out what happened when Dispel Magic (or Mordenkainen's Disjunction) was cast, then combat around 12th level took a significant amount of time.

My last 3.5E session was one combat that had players pre-rolling their attacks on their computers just so we could get it done in time. The calculations were horrible.

Comparatively, 4E was fast at high levels. But I wasn't playing with optimisers who were doing their best to do a lot of out-of-round actions. (My main complaint with 4E combat was that every combat took an hour... even the ones that should have been 10 minutes). 4E's major problem isn't with resolving actions, it's with CHOOSING an action when the battlefield might change so much between turns.

 

[Oofta]

I’m gonna need proof that you’ve asked multiple people to provide video of their fast combats.

Maybe a video?

In any case I think we did get an answer to how to run fast combats - no players! Well, max of 3 players, but still.