What happens when the Defender dies?

[Plane Sailing]

I guess it probably depends upon whether the DM is using published adventures with built-in assumptions about party makeup or is tailoring their own adventures (in which case they can make whatever allowances they want)

Cheers

 

[am181d]

Well, the roles have been made much more official, and less informal. That too me smells of harder delineation and separation, and less overlap.

The designers have said this isn't the case. The roles are there to help new players quickly grasp the assumptions have always been inherent to the system, but each class will be able to function to some degree outside their role.

(For folks who like sources, I *believe* this was addressed as recently at the Slashdot interview.)

 

[hong]

The basic balance they've said they were aiming for is that with a four person party you could drop one role, get two of another, and still be good with both the subtraction and the bonus. The Leader was the specific example - no leader still ok, two leaders not bad.

I'm sure it'll work fine for for the other roles. For the leader, well, I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Jack99]

As long as DND is a class-based game, there will always be a certain combination of classes which are better than other combinations.

Sure, it might be the best with 1 defender, 1 striker, 1 controller and 1 leader? That gives us at least 7 classes to mix and match. If that sticks, across all levels, I will be a happy gamer. After all, in 3.5, we really only have 3 core classes, in the end-game, if we wish to be optimal about it.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

first, the monsters will chose a new one for the rest of the encounter ^^

After the encounter, in a 4 players group, you should try to fill the role somehow. A new defender will surely do. A class which is only part-time defender should also do, if there is another part-time defender in the group.

In 3.5 a cleric could be his own tank, if you had also a ranger or rogue in the group.

Also you have to assume that in a 4 person party one "defender" is not enough. At least two other persons need to be "part time defenders" to defend a point in a plane properly (a triangle). At least, if there are no area taunts...

 

[Irda Ranger]

The defender going missing is fine. It's the leader going missing that looks likely to be the tough one. If experience is any guide, a party medic is the one indispensable role in games where such a role exists.

It's a lot easier to house rule Second Wind to be more useful (or Healing Herbs, Phoenix Downs, etc. to be more available) than make the Wizard into a Defender.

 

[hong]

It's a lot easier to house rule Second Wind to be more useful (or Healing Herbs, Phoenix Downs, etc. to be more available) than make the Wizard into a Defender.

I don't think you'd want to make a house rule just to cover when the leader's player can't show up.

 

[DeathMutant]

The difference between D&D and any MMOG (except, maybe, NWN) is that if you don't have a balanced party the Dungeon Master (a real person!) can compensate to still keep it fun and give you a chance -- unlike a computer opponent which would prefer to just slaughter you.

So, no Defender, no problem. Trust your Dungeon Master to keep the game fun (but don't expect him to keep you alive if you get in over your head and/or make stupid mistakes!)

ps. I've been in plenty of CoH groups without a tanker, it just takes rethinking the "standard" strategy of run in, get aggro, survive the alpha strike and clean-up.

 

[Kesh]

I don't think you'd want to make a house rule just to cover when the leader's player can't show up.

House rules pop up when the wizard's/rogue's/cleric's player drops out now. I figure it'll happen anyway in 4e.

 

[Grymar]

In my current campaign I have the following characters:

Ranger
Barbarian/Rogue
Druid
Bard

So by roles:
2 strikers
1 controller?
1 useless

And it is not a problem. As the DM I tailor the campaign to fit the party. It isn't their responsibility to fill roles, it is my responsibility to deliver a fun game for the characters they want to play.