What is 3.0 & 3.5 missing that previous editions had?

Psion · Mar 1, 2004

10 years between revisions.

Zappo · Mar 1, 2004

System flukes, headaches, arbitrary restrictions and lack of consistancy?

Mouseferatu · Mar 1, 2004

Mechanically? Very little. There are a few minor details from 1E/2E that I miss, but not much. In 99% of cases, the new system is superior.

But there was a feel and attitude in the old editions that I occasionally miss in 3E. The best example of it, as someone else mentioned, was the art. As far as I'm concerned, no suit of spike-covered semi-punk armor is ever going to be nearly as evocative as the classic knight in plate. But leaving aside the details of the pictures, I miss the old style. I don't like the trend toward comic-book-style art. When it comes to fantasy RPG artwork, I prefer my colors painted, and I prefer most of the art be black and white.

Yes, I said I prefer B&W most of the time. When done well, it can actually be more evocative.

I miss art that told a story or presented a scene, rather than character portraits. With the efreet on the coer of the old DMG, with the City of Brass in the background--or with the picture of Emirikol the Chaotic riding through some hapless town--you knew there was a story there somewhere.

Krieg · Mar 1, 2004

It's soul.

Cthulhu's Librarian · Mar 1, 2004

Mouseferatu said:
I miss art that told a story or presented a scene, rather than character portraits. With the efreet on the coer of the old DMG, with the City of Brass in the background--or with the picture of Emirikol the Chaotic riding through some hapless town--you knew there was a story there somewhere.

I think this is one of the things that I miss the most. When I look at the full page art in the Basic Sets, the PHB, MM, & DMG (both 1e & 2e), and especially the Dragon & Dungeon Magazine covers, I miss the scenic elements of the artwork. Almost all the artwork these days is either spot art, clip art, or portraits. There are no full page images (at least none that I can think off off the top of my head). Almost every cover on Dragon is a closeup of someones face, or a full body shot, but never a scene. Same with the rulebooks. The pictures used to tell stories, now they are supermodels.

Dimwhit · Mar 1, 2004

I know what it is for me. The rules (and most of the players) are so fixated on balance in 3ed. It's made it more vanilla that the previous editions. I like the new rules, don't get me wrong, but I'm sick of all the rules changes and talk of such and such not being balanced, etc. In earlier editions, you just played the game...

Chronosome · Mar 1, 2004

Mouseferatu said:
Mechanically? Very little. There are a few minor details from 1E/2E that I miss, but not much. In 99% of cases, the new system is superior.

But there was a feel and attitude in the old editions that I occasionally miss in 3E. The best example of it, as someone else mentioned, was the art. As far as I'm concerned, no suit of spike-covered semi-punk armor is ever going to be nearly as evocative as the classic knight in plate. But leaving aside the details of the pictures, I miss the old style. I don't like the trend toward comic-book-style art. When it comes to fantasy RPG artwork, I prefer my colors painted, and I prefer most of the art be black and white.

Yes, I said I prefer B&W most of the time. When done well, it can actually be more evocative.

I miss art that told a story or presented a scene, rather than character portraits. With the efreet on the coer of the old DMG, with the City of Brass in the background--or with the picture of Emirikol the Chaotic riding through some hapless town--you knew there was a story there somewhere.

Agreed.

diaglo · Mar 1, 2004

The cultists

Blood sacrifices

Heavy metal music

Dimly lit body odor infested parent’s basements

Rolling for stats

simplicity

Soul

Desdichado · Mar 1, 2004

Dimwhit said:
I know what it is for me. The rules (and most of the players) are so fixated on balance in 3ed. It's made it more vanilla that the previous editions. I like the new rules, don't get me wrong, but I'm sick of all the rules changes and talk of such and such not being balanced, etc. In earlier editions, you just played the game...

Sounds like a problem with players to me. We still "just play the game" in my neck of the woods.