What is a Paladin?

[italianranma]

What is a Paladin

And this isn’t a question of someone who’s new to the game either. I’m not talking about the d20 paladin: I’m not looking for a synopsis of the abilities and level progression, or a collection of stats, what I want to know is the core concept “What is a Paladin.”

I’m making my own home brewed campaign, and I’m using a different ruleset than d20 altogether so I’ve got a good chance to remake the class however I want to. I’ve got my own opinion of what the concept means to me, but I’d like to others’. If there’s one thing I do know from reading these forums, it’s that people have some pretty strong opinions on what paladins should be.

Now I do have a few ground rules for this discussion. First off, no discussion on statistics: "Paladins should be good melee combatants," is a good opinion. "Paladins should have +5 to hit bonuses," isn’t. Second, while saying something like Paladins should have fear immunity is good, explaining why you think so is even better. Here’s an example of what I’d like to see (not necessarily my opinion on them (did that sound like a lawyerism or what?)).

Concept: A melee combatant who specializes in fighting evil supernatural. Things that the common knight can’t handle.
Core abilities: The paladin should be a competent fighter rivaling other knightly. The paladin should be able to wear heavy armor and be able to fight mounted. He should also have abilities that combat typical undead and evil creatures ex: Fear immunity, disease immunity, and protection from mind control.
Other flavor: Paladins should be rare, and have an aura that radiates peace and makes them smell nice.

Now I just realized I need to give you some details: The game I’m creating is an amalgamation of Dungeons and Dragons themes/setting, and WoD d10 rules system. It doesn’t allow for a direct transcription, but for the most part if it’s in the standard d20 books, I’ll allow for it in the campaign.

The general setting will be using a 1400 level of technology (Crossbows are about the most advanced weapon, full-plate is expensive and the best protection around, steal is still in its beginning stages). The main action takes place on a large main continent (about the size of Europe and Africa, but not in the same shape) which isn’t fully explored. Humans, Dwarves, and Elves are the main ‘good’ races, but they distrust each-other immensely. Humans mainly inhabit the coastal areas: generally the more inland you go, the more dangerous and supernatural the world becomes. Elves and dwarves are more inland, but they still shy away from the greater center of the continent.

In general I cater to the PC’s wants. I’ve got a pretty good amount of politics planned, so if they want to play that game, they can. If they want to explore: that’s there for them too. For the most part: there’s the civilized human world where humans kill each-other and rarely fight monsterous enemies like goblinoids and ogres. Then there’s the frontier where the poorer humans must carve out a living; they generally have to deal with the supernatural almost as frequently as they do the mundane. Finally there’s the wild where if the PCs tread they’ll find mostly monsters and monsterous humanoids.

Hopefully that’s enough info to go on. Actually after rereading my text, I think I may have confused the point: I want more of a general discussion of what a paladin is, and then I’ll pick out what aspects of that I want for my game.

Edit: We're now discussing what role a paladin should play and what abilities are needed to play that role.

 

[Ender_rpm]

A Paladin is a riff on the "Holy Knights" of the roundtable, such as Gawain, who quested after the grail. Pious, chivalrous, and brave, thier faith gave them the will to persist in their quest, while thier force of arms, again due to the righteousness of thier cause, protected the weak against the wicked.

The backbone to the class is a monotheistic devotion to a deity, along with martial prowess. Mounted, unmounted, whatever. The key thing to a paladin is the quest. They have superiors outside the party that tell them to do things. It should be grand, or at least germaine to the churches interests. Protecting caravans of pilgrims, ok. Protecting a caravan of trade goods? Prolly not so much.

I personally like the idea of Paladin being a prestige class, fighter-priest type. Someone with a code of honor and conduct, that can be relied on to do the right thing, even if it causes them personal loss, for the glory of their deity. My $.02 anyway

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

To me the paladin is the righteous warrior. He believes in something larger than himself, right down to the very core of his being.

In terms of mechanics, obviously he needs the aspects to be a great fighter - armor, weapons etc.

Beyond that I've always felt that any special abilities should be linked to his belief. So, if his belief is that freedom is the ultimate right of every person, then he becomes stronger, harder to kill when fighting slavers, can call upon magic to free a persons shackles etc.

It is probably too difficult to make into a character class as I have described it, since it would have to be modified to make sense with an individual paladin's beliefs.

 

[Celebrim]

Historically, a paladin is a peer of the realm - a knight in service to a king who treats that knight as an equal and comrade. I believe the definitive use of the term is the knights that were in service to Charlemange, for example Roland.

The class itself is based on the romantic Christianized epic literature surrounding such knights. For example, there ability to 'lay on hands' comes from the medieval belief that a true king - being the chosen magistrate of God - had the power to cure wounds and disease by laying on hands. You can see this working in a different context in the Lord of the Rings, where Aragorn is known by his people to be the True King because 'the hands of the King are the hands of a healer'.

BTW, Aragorn is far closer in concept to the D&D Paladin than he is to a D&D Ranger, despite having inspired the later class.

 

[Gundark]

A Paladin is a core class in D&D 3.5 edition...duh!!

Sorry I apparently have nothing better to do but make dumb jokes...go back to the thread at hand

 

[Andre]

To me the paladin is the righteous warrior. He believes in something larger than himself, right down to the very core of his being.

In terms of mechanics, obviously he needs the aspects to be a great fighter - armor, weapons etc.

I agree wholeheartedly with the first sentence. The second, OTOH, works only for specific stereotypes, such as a Knight of the Round Table. I would argue that Harry Dresden (of the Dresden Files) is an outstanding example of a paladin (tho a very imperfect one). Yet, he's no fighter. No armor. No weapons, other than his magic staff (a hockey stick). But his heart and soul are devoted to helping those who can't help themselves.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

I agree wholeheartedly with the first sentence. The second, OTOH, works only for specific stereotypes, such as a Knight of the Round Table. I would argue that Harry Dresden (of the Dresden Files) is an outstanding example of a paladin (tho a very imperfect one). Yet, he's no fighter. No armor. No weapons, other than his magic staff (a hockey stick). But his heart and soul are devoted to helping those who can't help themselves.

I agree with you, but I was looking at it from the context of setting up a character class in the OPs setting.

 

[papastebu]

Check out the Exalted books for paladins in the White Wolf sense. You probably already have, but it's in the system, already, and it would require less work. I've felt that "Exalted" could have been called "Paladin" without losing much meaning.

As to what I think of the word and concept of "paladin", I would have to say that a paladin is a warrior--not necessarily armor-wearing or sword-wielding--in the service of God, chosen by Him to do specific works in the world of men. Due to His Covenent, God has prevented himself from interfering in situations where mankind's free will would be compromised. A paladin has free will, but also has a connection to the Almighty and a conviction to work His will in the world. A paladin is led to his duty, but the execution of that duty, and its method, are his choice. Ghandi was a paladin. Mother Theresa was a paladin. Martin Luther King was a paladin.
In the sense of an RPG--not rocket-propelled grenade--a paladin would be the person who went out to vanquish the dragon/demon/vampire/servant of an evil god, etc, because he knew that it was what was right, and it was what God--whomever "God" was to him--wanted him to do, and that it would save x-number of people's lives, souls, or whatever. I think that about covers it, for me.
I know I'm stepping on the "no religion" rule a bit, but I have to in order to define this as I see it.

 

[Stormborn]

A Paladin is the martial champion of a faith characterized by zealous devotion and adherance to a clearly defined code of behavior and manifested in mental, physical, and spiritual strength which can be viewed as a divine gift, a reflection of inner character, or (most likely) a combination of the two.

The DnD paladin is a fairly specific example of this in my way of thinking. Considering the mechanical benifits we have full BAB, good weapons and armor proficiencies, detect evil, smite, turning, lay on hands, divine grace, mount, and spells among other things.

Several of these, the ability to BAB, proficiencies, detect evil, smite, and turn, all have to do with protecting against or attacking the enemies of the faith and work well within the definition given above. If not adhering to standard DnD (or moding) I would say that the Paladin must have unique abilities to combat the foes of the faith. Simply being good at martial combat is not enough, something must differentiate this champion of the faith from other martial combatants who might be faithful. How that is manifested is up to you but I would suggest the ability to see through the deciets of the foe and manifest righteous wrath against them.

Some of them, lay on hands and the spells mostly, reflect the ability to aid the faithful - particularly the faithful who are fighting evil. I would suggest that characters that share the same faith as the paladin have some benifit to his, or her, presence. This could be a bardic/martial type effect or it could be closer to the core paladin.

Other abilities reflect the inner spiritual strenght of the paladin, notably divine grace and immunity to fear. My suggestion is to determin what kinds of attacks the enemy of the faith uses the most and grant the Paladin a degree of immunity to that. If magic something like SR, if illusion then the ability to see through it, if enchantment then fear and charm immunity, etc.

Different orders could focus on different roles and thus manifest different abilities. One that was dedicated to harrowing the enemy might have abilities at tracking, light armor, and a favored enemy type bonus. Guardians of important figures and sites might have different abilities while those that act as religious judges or inquisitors still others.

In a fantasy realm there are a lot of roles that one could point to and say "that is a person is a paladin", far beyond the mounted holy warrior of core DnD. The key distinction will the level of their devotion and the manifestations of it.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I am alongside Stormborne with this one. IMHO a 'paladin' is a chosen of a diety for the purpose of being the 'fist' as opposed to the cleric, or 'face' of the diety to the world at large.

Normally this means proficient fighter, but it would depend on the diety in question.

Mechanicaly I prefer either a feat-n-skills approach or a PRC that uses the path concept, allowing to have different flavours of a paladin. The cost of taking levels of purchasing skills/feats represent the devotion.
- However, since the abilities are divinely inspired there needs to be a means of dimming them, or turning them off, based on adherence to the dieties code. Which is where it gets sticky from a meta-game perspective.